LaBarbera lifted

Jim Fox has his play pegged accurately, which is his given up a few goals he'd like to have back, and the rest is on the teams defensive mental mistakes.

I agree with this 100%.

hes been good for the most part although the weak goals are the ones that deflate the team

Despite the breakdowns, a couple of those goals were very stoppable. I've been a fan of Barbs for a few years now, hoping he'd become a consistent goaltender, but he just hasn't done it. Despite being in a pretty difficult situation (on a bad team for the past few years) I just think he has had plenty of time to prove he can make the big save consistently. With that said, it's clear to me that on just about any other team, he'd only be a #2 goalie. And that's probably where he'll end up soon.

I think Labs has done a pretty good job so far......but We need to work on those SOFT goals he has allowed in the net......and I personally think LABS is a "good" back up goalie, not a #1........... Who will Johnathon learn from?

Ersberg better start the next game.. he's earned it. then let Labs do whatever it is that he does the following game.

last night Fox said Labarbera was going to start (his prediction) "65 games" this season. I recall Rich, when asked about it, thought Labs would start about 60 games.

I think that's absurd. not only has he never shown he can handle the workload or deserves that number of starts, he's almost assured to break down over the course of the season. I say if they stick with that plan, after 45 games he's going to be on IR and then Ersberg will be our defacto #1 anyway. so it will have been a completely worthless experiment. not to mention his stats are already dropping like flies because of the last three games. 2-3, 2.98, .889? the first two starts vs. SJ were solid, but despite that his season stats are already not nearly good enough.

he needs a .910 sv% if he's going to be considered a #1 and lead us out of the lottery this year. otherwise we're looking at another 80 point season, and Ersberg at the top of the goaltending stats for the 2nd year in a row for the LA Kings.

Frankly, I think Babs has played pretty well. The team as a whole has done a decent job in front of him as well. I wasn't expecting the moon when this season started and to my eyes at least, Babs has been a pleasant surprise. Props to him, Bill Ranford, and the entire coaching staff for the positive shift.

All of the goals against were not bad goals individually, but together they were bad goals against. Three goals on six shot is never okay, NHL goalies just can't do that and expect their teams to win.

I don't think that Labarbara was as mentally ready to play as he should have been. Mental mistakes by a few skaters led to the turnovers, but the goalie was not able to bail out his teammates with a big save all night. If Labarbara had stopped Smyth's second goal, he might have stayed in the game.

JLB saved the game against Carolina, but could not help his teammates enough to get the win last night.

I hope Ersberg plays both games and strips away the starting job from Barbs.
Jason just isn't talented enough to cut it as a #1 goalie. Its a far fetched dream and it needs to be put to rest.

I say Ersberg gets the start against the Blues. In all fairness, Labarbera hasn't really shown that he is without a doubt deserving of the #1 spot, and Ersberg hasn't even gotten a shot to show what he might be able to do. He looked very poised in the 20 mins he played against the Avs, regardless of them only mustering 2 SOG.

I guess Murray remember that he had Labarbera on his fantasy hockey team.

Labarbera has played well at times, and has looked dreadful at times, letting in goals no NHL caliber goalie has any business letting in. But that's the story of his career. Why the kings keep giving him chances is really beyond me. every year he starts as the 1 or 1A is yet another year he will end up being in the doghouse. sure he's looked unstoppable at times in the AHL, but that's because it's the AHL. he has NEVER done that at the NHL level, and yet we give him chance after chance.

now all this talk about starting him 65 games, when many of the top established goaltenders in the league don't even start that many games, really perplexes me. unless it's another ploy to get a top pick... if Ersberg is put behind the new rejuvenated defense, we would have won the Colorado game, and there's a chance for the playoffs.

To Ersberg:

labarbera would do less damage to his fantasy team on the bench.

I'll be in Nashville for the game on Saturday, and I am hoping the Kings will be led out by Ersberg, because frankly, I never miss home games and this trend of having to watch LaBarbera is just not as enthusiasm-laden as if I were to watch ANYONE else. Just me, personally...

You all forget that LaBarbara is a UFA this summer with the heir-apparent in the wings. I firmly believe the organization has no intention to keep him past the trade deadline - which is why he's going to get so many starts to pump his value up as much as possible.

It doesn't matter how bad he plays (sorry but goals #2 and #3 my grandma could have stopped) or if he doesn't lose another game he's traded for picks.

Some defensive mistakes were made last night resulting in turnover goals, but as a #1 you have to make a couple big saves if you want to give your team a chance to win. The kings nearly out shot the aves 2 to 1 last night. There's no excuse for 3 goals on 6 shots, you rarely even see that in shoot outs where chances are a 1000 times better. I was a big Ersberg fan last season, he started the one game I went to last season and was very impressive, the guy's a human sponge. I was a little disappointed when Ersberg didn't get the #1 job, in my opinion it was his to lose.
I'm really liking what I'm seeing from the rest of the team, even with the rookie mistakes they're still out shooting their opponents and the PK is stellar. A perfect PK from these rookies says a lot.
Ersberg=playoffs
Labs=a lot of 1 goal losses

every goalie is going to have a bad game. just ask marty turco. but, at the same time, three goals on six shots is inexcusable.

I'm glad Ersberg will get a shot.

Barbs has done a decent job in net but he hasn't shown any spectacular saves and the only thing that has kept him from having a worse record is the lucky bounces that have gone his way during the times that he was caught off guard. I feel that Ersberg, once given the chance on this new revived defense, can make an impact and help the team steal the games that they need.

I think the Kings improved D has saved us from seeing how bad Labarbera really is this year. Sure we the D made a few mistakes, but he should have stopped many of those goals and his track record, regardless of how good he looked in camp this year, doesn't justify him starting the first 5 games. We do not have a clear NHL #1 guy in our system yet, we will but not now. I'd be rotating with Ersberg and let the better guy play more.
Ersberg was not tested at all last night, but he needs a chance to play, not ride the bench.

I wonder why LA has a hard time finding decent goalies. Could it be the whinging about how everything is the goalies fault and "no other NHL goalie would allow that goal?"
Maybe the goaltending coach needs to go. Maybe the Blues will give us Legace back. We'd run him out of town in 2 weeks.
What I saw last night was 4 goals on defensive breakdowns. Something we saw coming in August.

While it's unfair to blame Labarbera for 3 goals that came on bad turnovers, you DO need a goalie who can bail out your defensemen a good percentage of the time.

Being a true #1 goalie isn't just about not giving up bad goals, it's about coming up with some big saves for your team.

cristobal, i see where you're coming from, but by the same token, we can't always give the goalies the same excuse every time around. the past few seasons, our defense sucked horribly, and any goaltender thrown into those games would have suffered. however, the team defense i've seen this year, albeit over a very small sample size, is vastly improved over past years. every team has a few defensive breakdowns each game, and it's up to the goalie to bail the guys in front of him out once in awhile. labarbera has no history of doing that, and last night's game was yet another example of it.

bottom line, if 4 defensive breakdowns leads to 4 goals every game, we're not going to win anything. but, if 4 defensive breakdowns only leads to 1 or 2 goals, we still have a chance. labarbera will always give you the former.

Barbs is exactly what we all think he is...He's the caretaker until Bernier is ready.
He has his good games and his bad games. When he's on, he can steal a game or two for you...when he's not, he makes you squirm on your couch watching shots from all angles.
He's a middle of the road goalie..someone who will be serviceable to a team towards the trading deadline. Injuries haven't hit yet in the league. Teams will be looking for a serviceable goalie down the stretch...especially one who's a UFA this summer.

Smyth's goal was a great effort and skill goal--no faulting Barbs on that one...even if you suggest he should have tried a poke-check, he might have missed and Smyth has a much easier shot. In order to score, Smyth had to be just about perfect. That's ok with me--those goals are going to happen.
What concerns me is the number of goals Barbs has given up on screen or partial screen shots. It happened yesterday and it happened against the Ducks and Sharks. Either he's picking up the puck late, or he's not in position before the shot--Bill Ranford would certainly know better than I on that point. That said, he needed to be a stopper on at least one of the giveaway goals...'Zus (in particular) and Preissing have played too well not to be bailed out just once when a rare turnover happens...maybe that's concentration (not being ready in case of a TO) or positioning--again, Ranford's the one to answer that question. Either way, it needs to be fixed. Barbs looks much better overall than last year, but (and it's doable) he's got to be that one bit sharper to steal a game or two. I still think he's capable enough to succeed as a number one goaltender.

I gotta say Labs was atrocious last night. I don't care how bad the defense was, he should do better even in shootouts. In a way I think the defense should have let more shots through because Labs seems to do better with more shots.
But I also think that Ersberg has more to prove. Don't forget Labs has also had stretches of 10-15 games that he's been the man. He had one three years ago before his girlfriend got sick. He had one last year (wasn't he defensive player of the month)? He had a whole year in the AHL. Erik had an awesome run last year but that's it, AND he sucked in the AHL. So while I think Erik deserves a shot I don't agree that he's any kind of automatic improvement over Labs.

And I disagree with everyone who says Labs sits on any other team. I'm almost positive that like Huet, Labs will be a starter, and a good one, on another team.

cristobal>
We out shot them nearly 2 to 1, had a perfect PK and had far better chances.
sure 3 of the goals I believe were defensive turnovers, the preissing one was horrid, but come on 3 out of 6?
Most NHL goalies will do better than that without a defense period. Just look at the shootout save %'s across the league.

Labs - My advice is to quit the slim-down routine. Get big, get strong, go into the butterfly and let the puck hit you. Don't take it personally if the defense keeps passing the puck to the opposition (Hejduk of all people) in prime scoring position. Maybe get into a few fights, or skate the puck out of the zone yourself.

Who has statistics on how many times the Kings failed to clear the zone, or turnovers in the defensive zone?

Charles - I cannot agree with you at all. Again, I was in favor of Ersberg being the starter, but once you pick Labs, you've got to stick with him. Again, if Doughty, Preissing, Handzus and the rest are given the room for error this season, I think you stick with Labs until he falls apart, or the team really quits. I didn't think the team quit last night, or that the game was out of reach.

You guys know what I think of LaBarbara, so all I'll say is if coach Murray would give Ersberg the same chance he's given LaBarbara so far, Ersberg would end up being the #1 goalie for the rest of the year. He wouldn't have given up half the goals LaBarbara has.

Soft goals are horrible. I actually pin the loss on Labs. He has to stop one of the the goals that was the result of a mistake. I say give Ersberg the chance to win the #1 spot.

I don't think was it Labs or the turnovers that cost us the game. It was our horrible ice surface. There way too many times in the third where the puck wouldn't settle down for our forwards and it cost us quality scoring chances. Its knocking our skill level down significantly. Something needs to be done.

cristobal>
I disagree with you completely.
If making Labs the #1 is a mistake you don't fix it by sticking with him especially with the season this young just to save face.
Neither goalie is a proven #1
The correct decision here is to split the goalies evenly and let one of them earn the #1.
Giving Labs the #1 without him earning it was a bad call, and it's not too late.

If Labs earns it in the end then fine, but as of now he has proven nothing. It's not like he was a proven goalie that had a good camp that had one bad game.

HBfan - add to that the glass popping out or breaking 3 games in a row. Staples = Shoddy = Shite

Keep up the good work AEG.

I think that Lombardi has asked TM to showcase Barbs so that we can dump him at the trade deadline. If we can put a presentable defense in front of him ( and I think we can) we might actually get something for him. I agree with this analysis:

Anonymous said:
You all forget that LaBarbara is a UFA this summer with the heir-apparent in the wings. I firmly believe the organization has no intention to keep him past the trade deadline - which is why he's going to get so many starts to pump his value up as much as possible.

I also think that there is no way JLB will make it to 60 games. He WILL get injured which of course throws a monkey wrench into the above mentioned course of thinking. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out.

Charles - There are only a handful of Proven players on this team. You're also not supposed to go into an NHL season with 4 veterans, but we're doing it. So just let these guys make their mistakes, take their lumps, and worry over wether they're bad goals in the 09-10 season.

cristobal>

I agree with you there, and think that Ersberg deserves the same opportunities as every one else. Last time I checked he had a crown on his Jersy.

Barbs has played better than I thought he would this year. I was looking at 2-7-1, 3.33, .9 over his first 10 games. I do think that he is the type of GK that plays better with more work. I would put him back in on Friday.
Erbs seemed to look better last year than he did during camp this year, but he may one of those "game" guys. I'd go with him Saturday.

Sure, but not until Labs has REALLY been responsible for the losses, and not after the 5th game. More like the 35th. There's plenty of time for us to play 10 netminders this season.

JL is not #1 material all the soft goals this year alone speak for that. I knew when Terry "gave" him the #1 it was only a matter of (short) time before he blew it. Its time to give Ersberg a fair shot as JL has been given multiple times by now. Unless JL can somehow do a great Patrick Roy impression the rest of the season he has no future with this team. If Ersberg can repeat his performance from last season and either of the Jonathon's have a strong start in Manchester JL could be finished really soon.

All Labarbera has shown is that he can be a good AHL goalie, and the road is littered with good AHL goalies. He couldn't even make it with the NYR when they had a black hole in their net.

For the first time in a long while, it looks like our Kings actually might be competitive which is why it hurts that much more to see our own goalie rob us of wins. The Kings dominated that game and somehow still lost in regulation.

Terry Murray is our new coach and should not show any loyalty to guys that symbolize the failures of the old regime such as Jason Labarbera. He has been given far too many chances and games like last night just show us that he is just another reincarnation of Dan Cloutier. We need to either start Ersberg and see what we have or bite the bullet and trade for Khabibulin. I refuse to shell out any more money to sit in the expensive Premier seats just to watch goaltenders that I can score on.

look, if labarbera had ever shown that he was a good goaltender at the nhl level, he would merit a second, third, or even fourth chance. the problem is that each time he's given the opportunity, he has squandered it.

i'm not saying his failures were not partly due to the poor defense in front of him in past years. but ersberg had the SAME defense in front of him, and excelled last year, even if it was only for a small number of games. regardless, that was the first time in a long time kings fans have had any glimmer of hope from the goaltender. now that glimmer of hope is sitting at the end of the bench game in and game out, for no good reason, and the broken record is once again botching games for us. didn't ersberg at least earn a shot to be our #1 based on last year's play? he looked better than labarbera EVER has.

Labarbera was hung out to dry last night. You want your goalie to come up with the big save at the right time but sometimes that just doesnt go as planned. That doesnt mean we should just push him aside for the next guy(ersberg), which is what the management has been doing for the past two years.
I like that they declare him the number 1 goalie. It installs confidence in his play and tells him to just go out and do his job. Here in calgary, Kipersoff has been off to a slow start but they dont hang their goalie like we do. They have faith in their team. Have a little faith in yours.

jcclark>

please do not tell me you just compared labarbera to kiprusoff... kiprusoff has PROVEN that he is not only a #1, but an elite goaltender in the league. he has EARNED the patience of his fans, and people KNOW he has the capability to turn it around.

labarbera on a good day is not as good as kipper on a bad day. he has proven NOTHING at the nhl level. what exactly are we being patient for? what are we hoping for? a level of play that he has never exhibited?? faith in a proven #1 is not the same as blind faith in a #2/career AHLer.

Plain and simple, Lab is not a #1 goalie in any NHL team. I could hardly imagine him as a back up with all the cheap goals that are scored against him. Waive, trade or AHL. Just not in a KINGS uniform.

I definitely agree the ice has been horrific this season. usually you only see that kind of mush in Anaheim, but the ice at Staples has definitely come down a couple of notches in just a season or two. I remember 2 games ago on TV they interviewed somebody from the Kings between periods, Brown I think and he was just commenting on how horrific it was. what happened, it's like they're not even trying to make sure there's a decent NHL ice surface anymore.

can't blame it on the building being too hot because it's too full with all those warm bodies. that hasn't been the case in 4 or 5 years. with the price of tickets being what they are - you've got our money, FIX IT!

I strongly disagree Labs was hung out to dry.. with the exception of the Smyth move / puck bounce on Doughty where he scored on an exceptional shot, everything else was stoppable and no NHL goaltender should give up goals #2 AND 3 that he handed to the Avs. they were just brutal - you've gotta make at least one of those saves, and then the Kings get a point to take them to OT.

The tables seem to have turned. I'm the one defending our players talents, and all the people seem to be saying I'm wrong.
Has anyone thought to question the goaltending coach/es? I know Ranford was a great netminder, but he WAS on a dynasty. I didn't think his comments between the 2nd and 3rd periods were fair to Labarbara. As a netminder, I think Ranford would have had a few choice words for the skater who put him in the position he found himself in. Ranford seemed to be blaming Labarbara for not keeping his team in the game with a big save, as do many of the Kings fans. I, personally, don't think he's given up ANY soft goals. Even Davey Jones's shot was well placed an from a dangerous position at the top of the circles. If Murray wants to build confidence in his netminder, he needs to stand by him when things go wrong. Its an 82 game season, things are going to go the wrong way a certain percentage of the time.

BTW - I don't know if anyone else happened to see it, and I'm not saying Labarbara is comparable to Patrick Roy. BUT...

I watched NHL classics a couple of weeks ago and they highlighted the '93 series between Montreal (ROY) and Quebec (Hextall). At the beginning of the season Demeres stated the ROY was his guy and that he'd stick with him throughout. Many in the Montreal press were crowing that Andre Racicot should be the guy. Montreal lost the first two games of the series at home and Roy made some horrible mistakes. Demeres stuck with him and Roy won them the series. He won 10 overtime games in the playoffs, and they won the Stanley Cup against our Kings. AGAIN, I'm not saying Labarbara is going to turn into Roy if we stick with him, but he's serviceable for this season. If his confidence is destroyed, he's worthless. There is no bigger mind-trip in the NHL than goalie. I don't think pulling him at that point in the game helps.

the big saves don't matter if the soft ones are let in.

That from a thug-winger whose career highlight was cross-checking Gretzky into premature physical break-down.

Ha Ha, just kidding.
Baumgartner was like a MiniMcSorley, just not as good at hockey.

First of all, I don't think JLB being pulled in last night's game is indicative of anything other than the Kings had a bad period and TM was firing a shot across the bow.

Second, I don't think JLB let in any truly soft goals last night. By definition, a soft goal is one in which the skaters are in position and have not committed any kind of give-away or missed assignment that leads to the goal in question. The goals last night were more of the category "he could have made a brilliant save and kept that one out, but he didn't." (One the Smyth goal where he beat Doughty, it's next to impossible to stop a shot that deflects off the intersection of the cross-bar and post and then in; that's as freakishly perfect a shot as you're going to get.)

Third, Terry Murray is giving JLB room enough to succeed or fail on his own. This is a win-win for the Kings. If he plays well, the Kings can either ride him into the playoffs or trade him at peak value. If he doesn't, the JLB era is over and there are several guys waiting for their shot.

Fourth, we have no idea what DL's strategy is regarding the goaltenders. It might well be that he has no intention of bringing up Bernier this season. It might be that he thinks Bernier is likely to join the Kings at some point this year, more or less for good. Or, he might just be waiting to see what happens. Personally, I don't think DL needs to decide anything now. He has the time to make a decision on JLB based on how he actually plays, and that seems like a pretty good idea to me.

When it would (hypothetically) get interesting, though, is if the Kings play well enough to have a shot at the playoffs when the trade deadline comes around. If the Kings were still in the hunt, and JLB has been a part of that, you would think his stock would be pretty high at that point. JLB is a UFA next summer. If DL keeps him, and the Kings were to make the playoffs (to say nothing of stealing a round or two) suddenly JLB becomes expensive in the summer of '09. Does DL trade JLB at the deadline, knowing that his stock will never be higher and that JLB can walk come 7-1 no matter what?

I think he trades him. I actually think the whole reason for going with JLB now -- strike that, not the whole reason, but part of the reason -- is to be smart with him as an asset in preparation for trading him before he's a UFA. It helps that Bernier was hurt in camp and only Ersberg is qualified right now to challenge LaBarbera.

My hope is that the Kings have their growing pains now and smooth themselves out by January 1, that Bernier heals and puts together a good string of wins in Manchester, while JLB plays well enough to be traded to a contender in need of playoff back-up insurance. Then Bernier can come up and play with Ersberg, beating my pre-season point prediction by ten points, and making the playoffs as the eighth seed, where they will play San Jose in the first round.

Just as cristobal can not believe he is defending a Kings player, I can not believe that I am defending Cristobal. But he is absolutely correct. Barbs is the most experienced Gk in our organization at the present time. If TM does anything to diminish his confidence, then we could be in for a long season. I would also like to see Ersberg get a shot, but I do not want to put the entire season in the hands of someone who has 17 North America games. If we go with Ersberg now and he fails, then we have no back up plan and over 90% of the season to play. Such an abyss, would be a terrible thing to do to the kids.

I might as well join in the fray. Lababs is a decent goalie but he's not a No. 1. Too inconsistant, sometimes he makes unbelievable saves, sometimes he allows goals that could have been swatted out with a broom. I'd like to see Ersberg given a chance to see what our kids can really do. In reality, he's part of the solution. If Ersberg can remain steady, it gives our kids in the AHL time. I kinda like the idea of Lababs backing up Ersberg until Ersberg looses the job. At that point I'd be looking at a call up from Manchester if that doesn't work. Too many soft goals allowed by Lababs, inconsistant play, physically inconsistant too.

Just cause JL is the most experienced goalie we have doesn't mean hes #1 material. Hes been given chances to solidify being a #1 and has never risen to the challenge. You can blame the teams in front of him all you want over the last few seasons but the soft goals this year are his fault. Lets Ersberg play and have a real legit shot his play last season alone warrants that. 2 shutouts (in 14 games) last year behind that defense hes got some chops and nice rebound control.

Well said Quisp, I stopped lurking and signed up to make this comment.

Patience guys, let's not panick after 1 loss... Ersberg will get his chance if LaBarbera fails...

I still don't understand the point of ruining Barbs confidence by pulling him. I think that's completely ridiculous. This is the NHL folks...The best players in the world reside in this league. If he has such fragile confidence, he would have never made it this far. EVERY goalie that's ever played a significant number of games has been pulled..either for poor play or to give the team a wake up call. All goalies understand this and have been living with this since they were playing peewee hockey. It's just like a forward or a defenseman who gets benched for lack of hustle...or sometimes for no apparent reason.
If Barbs wasn't able to handle getting yanked, he would never have made it to the NHL.
We need to stop treating him as if he's a fragile piece of china and remember that he's a professional athlete. And if I'm wrong (which I'm not)and he isn't strong mentally, then he needs to go.

Cristobal..
"For me, Murray has 3 red flags. Not playing Harrold, dropping Boyle, and pulling Labs. I just don't think it fits in with the rebuild ethic that is supposed to be the focus"

How do you figure?
Boyle age 22 Richardson age 23
Harrold age 25 Quincey age 23
Labarbara age 28 Ersberg age 26

We can debate who's better between the players, but the part about going against the rebuilding ethic is false.

Hey Sev, welcome aboard. We have been starved for a Gk for half a generation, so every soft goal is like a punch to the nose.

BTW, it is suppose to be between 90-100 degrees for the next week. Could you possibly reach over and crack a window?

Hi Jet,

I've been a kings fan since 1990 so I've been suffering with you for 18 years... I still have dreams over what could have been in 1993... To top it all of, I face daily bashings from Montreal fans... Hockey is very popular here and having a bad kings team hurts double as Montreal fans think that the Canadians are the best team in the world, even during seasons that they sucked... They don't understand how anyone can like the kings, let alone someone from Montreal. :)

As for the heat, it is starting to get cold here so I have no mercy for you. ;-)

Sev

Oh an by the way, thank you Rich for this site. I am on here at least ten times a day and along with NHL center ice, I feel like I am right in the middle of the action! :)

NYKINGSFAN - The point of this rebuild is to go with the players in our system and give them a decent shot at proving themselves. Boyle and Harrold were both dropped after participating in wins. Labarbara is pulled after his defense hangs him out to dry. It has nothing to do with their age. And, I never said Quincey should NOT be playing.

If Murray wants to spark the team, play O'Sullivan with Kopitar and Brown in the 3rd. Moulson is 25. If he's not half the player O'Sullivan is now, he's not a 1st line winger in the NHL. There are plenty of guys in the AHL who can score in bundles but will never stick on a decent NHL team.

Head games with the netminder is not a good idea. Patrick Roy left Montreal because of head games from the coaches.
Again. Perhaps the goaltending coach is the one who should get the hook. Cloutier, Garon, Labarbara, and 10-12 other goalies down the drain. Its really starting to look like there is a cancer in the system. No other team has torn through so many goalies.

Jet - all this reactionary nonsense from the fans is inexcusable. Sean Burke and Felix Potvin were very good for the Kings. Even Garon performed well for a while. The defense is the problem. This years model is no different. If that Colo. game were a playoff game, the Nation would have seen all those mistakes and there would be no focus on Labarbara. The loss would be credited to MISTAKES by the defense, which you cannot make and expect to win. Just like you can't fumble 3 times in football and expect to win. Just like you can't turn the basketball over repeatedly and expect to win.

labarbera is a polarizing figure, i guess we've figured that out, the most comments by far of any recent topic.

with that said, he is not even close to our goalie of the future. if, as management has already conceded, this is a "throw away" season (although us fans would like to hope differently), wouldn't one goal of the organization be not to alienate fans during a rebuild? i'm not saying that labarbera is the right or wrong choice from a hockey standpoint. but if a majority (based on positive-negative comment ratios dating back to god knows when) has absolutely no faith in him, wouldn't it make sense to play a goalie the fans appear to have more faith in, leading to more ticket sales?

i am one of the many die-hards who have fallen on tough economic times, so the number of games i will be going to will probably be lower this year. believe me, i would be much more willing to dish out cash to see someone i have even a little faith in, rather than go in knowing full well that i'll be watching another game where yet another 3 soft goals go in and my team loses even when they outplayed and outhustled the opposition.

I really need to start concentrating more at work instead of constantly reading this blog...NAH!!!!

I think the rebuilding process means getting younger...To me if someone is better from the outside, then bring him in. I don't know whether Richardson is better, but he's young enough to be considered a part of the rebuilding process...as much as Boyle or Purcell is. I'm like you..I'm partial to our own guys from the farm system, but now it's all about getting better so we can compete.
If you want Harrold to play, who's sitting? I think Gauthier has been fine...Preissing, except for one bad play, has been good...Doughty, OD, Greene, Quincey have all been very good. Who deserves to sit?

Head games are one thing, but pulling Barbs to start the 3rd period is far from head games...Can you tell me that Roy was never pulled from a game during his career? How about Brodeur? We can debate whether the yanking was justified based on his play, but the fact was the Kings played a horrible 2nd period and TM decided to make a change. For whatever the reason, the Kings played a great 3rd period.
We held Colorado to 16 shots. That's an incredibly low total to keep a team to. I understand that their were a couple of defensive breakdowns and while they are never acceptible, holding a team to 16 shots is a great defensive effort. The goals they scored were not all Barbs fault, but you can't tell me that a couple of those goals were impossible saves for him to make.
The Devils have always played a sound defensive style, but every once in a while they have a defensive breakdown, but they count on Brodeur to come up with the big save and most times, he does. We needed Barbs to make a save on some of those goals...even one, and he didn't.

TM isn't here to keep feelings from getting hurt. If JLB has a problem with getting pulled he has to deal with it. It's TM's job to try to win games, and he obviously thought that keeping JLB in goal for the third period was going to serve no purpose, so better to get EE some work.

anonymous - labarbara is not a polarizing figure, Murray's decision to bench him (after the team collapsed 3 times, not 3 soft goals) is the polarizing incident.

Are you willing to pay to see Moulson as your top winger?

Are you willing to pay top dollar for a team that has IT'S OWN salary cap 15 million dollars below the league's?

deadcat - haven't you ever heard of sports psychology? Confidence is important with skaters, but with goalies, its everything. Why did Garon look like a 10 year old out there with the Kings but is winning 30 games a season with Edmonton?

NYKINGFAN - With all due respect, I'm done with the Labarbara topic. I think its a bad move and unless Labarbara rises to the challenge because of it, we've lost 1 goalie already.
Let's bring Bernier up and play him. I want to see everyone shit their pants when he gets shellacked. I want everyone to say how smart Lombardi is when Bernier allows 7 or 8 a night. Let's do it.
Bernier is our Guaranteed guy of the future. Well, lets go.

All this whinging about Labarbara is certainly taking the spotlight off of Moulson disappearing out there. I've seen literally hundreds of comments about Labarbara and Boyle and Harrold (all Taylor guys) but only Anthony being honest about Moulson. Not to mention, where was Stoll the other night? Or Greene? Nothing critical?

Where is the criticism of the goaltending coaches? How many goalies can they go through before they start pointing the finger at themselves?

cristobal>

labarbera is polarizing in the sense that kings fans either seem to defend him or hate him to death, whether justified or not. it's been that way long before terry murray got here. i think we can all agree on that.

my point is this, and it's simple. labarbera has sucked for four years. he has played well in the ahl, big whoop. but his softies are not news to us anymore. i'm not saying ersberg is our savior, but at least he has shown us more in 14 games than labarbera has shown in all of his chances combined. what is the justification in not even giving erik a shot to see if he's the real deal? and what is the payoff in the alternative, giving labarbera a third or fourth shot? i just don't get it.

as for moulson, i too would like to see him taken off the first line, but it's 5 been games, not 4 years.

as for the salary cap, it's frustrating, but at least to me, understandable. i see the reasoning behind saving money to sign key players later on. and no matter how much money AEG has, i wouldn't want to toss an extra $15 mil into a sucky product. look where throwing money around has gotten us the last few years. plus, if you sign a big contract, you demote or take time from a developing player. from a rebuilding standpoint, i think we're doing it the right way.

Cristobal -

I think you are over-analyzing a non-issue. Anyway, you're choosing to interpret putting in Ersberg as a knock against LaBarbera. Remember when Crawford didn't pull Bernier after five goals or whatever it was, and everyone freaked out, saying he should have protected Bernier? Do you remember when Roy pitched a fit after the Habs left him in for eight or nine goals? How do you know this (protecting him) wasn't what was going on with JLB in the last game? How do you know Murray wasn't just trying to get Ersberg some playing time with no pressure (since the Kings were already in a hole)?

cristobal>

patience. sure the people you've named haven't shown much, but they also haven't shown nothing to us in four years. if even one or two years later, they still suck, i'm sure people will start piling on them as well. the frustrating thing about labarbera is that it seems like a broken record, and we can't seem to be able to move on.

correct, the coaches may also be held accountable. but in their defense, they really haven't had much to work with since the new regime came in. the best coaches in the world wouldn't be able to mold crap goalies into studs.

Quisp - I like how you say I'm the one over analyzing. That's rich.

That was 7 goals agains with Bernier. A 19 year old.

If Roy were pulled after giving up those 4 goals after turnovers, he'd have left the team, like he did after being left in for 7 or 8.

2 goals down is the shallowest hole I've ever heard of. In hockey its called the "worst lead in sports" actually.

Playing time with no pressure is called practice.

Do you EVER disagree with what the coaches do? How many goalies do we have to go through before someone besides ME starts to question the goaltending coaches?

Cristobal -

SPORTS PSYCHOLOGY: since you mentioned it. Look at your own reactions. You are all over the place. Before the season, you're throwing the Kings under the bus. You're renouncing the Kings and declaring allegiance to the Ducks. Then the Kings win two games, and it's like we won the cup. Then they lose one game by one goal and you're freaking out over switching goalies and scratching Harrold and Boyle, blaming the coach, the GM, ownership, goalie coaches and (drum roll) Matt Moulson. Sports Psychology, the goal of which is to achieve balance under pressure. You would do well to get some.

"How many goalies will they go through before they start pointing fingers at themselves?" The Kings haven't gone through ANY goalies.

"Only Anthony is being honest about Moulson." HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Typing whatever hysterical thing that pops into your head without thinking about whether it makes any sense except in a toddler-brain give-me-a-cookie sort of way is not the same thing as honesty.

re the cap:

The Kings are, I think, about 10 million below the cap ceiling, and about 5 million above it.

anonymous - I AM being the patient one here. None of you seem to get that. The only "broken record" here is the Kings futility. Was Labarbara the problem the last 2 years?

The Kings are currently on course for a 64 point season. Crushing my prediction of 50. I'm not the one who needs to be patient. I'm just one of the few who knows Labarbara wasn't at fault the other night. It was Handzus, Preissing and Doughty.

Cristobal

we allowed 16 shots on goal...what more do you want the defense to do? How can you go after Greene? What did he do wrong?
Whats up with the Bernier comment? He's the future between the pipes for the Kings. When he's ready, DL will bring him up...not before.
After all DL has done during this off-season and beginning of the season, can we at least trust his judgement?
I don't care who plays goal, as long as they stop the damn puck. Barbs is not the future of the Kings....Everyone here knows that...except it seems, for you.
Also, when your only ally is Anthony..you're in deep poop. That's meant more as a joke.
I've also said that I haven't been happy with the play of Moulson so far, but I'm willing to give him more than 5 games to pick up his play...the same as I'm willing to give Kopitar and Brown more than 5 games to pick up their play.

cristobal - i think we're just on different pages. sure, i blame labarbera over the last game more than you, but i'm not as much frustrated about that game as i am about his underperforming for the better part of 3 of the last 4 seasons. the only year he was stellar was when he was stuck in the ahl (surprise), where the shots he faced weren't quite as quality as he's seeing now. i don't care about the last game, other than the fact that it was a microcosm of his career, yet another blown opportunity to show us that he can be a capable #1 by bailing out the defense's shortcomings, even if only once in awhile. not to mention all the softies he lets in each game. if each defensive lapse lead to a goal, we wouldn't even need goalies anymore, it would just become basketball on ice.

Wow, quite a rant Quisp. Nice insult about toddler brains and all. I will refer you to the "commenting" post by Rich.

The Kings haven't gone through any goalies? Really?

I'm not freaking out about the goalie being pulled, Quisp. I've been discussing it ad naseaum with all the people who are ready to throw Labarbara under the bus after 5 games. I simply said I disagree with it and have pointed out that the goaltending coaches are not doing a good job so maybe they should take a look at themselves.

Quisp, you wouldn't know about honesty in regards to the Kings because anything they do is ok with you. There's being realistic and there's being blind. For you, criticism equates to freaking out and throwing the team under the bus.

NYKINGSFAN - Labarbara lost to San Jose 0-1. Is that his fault? If you want patience with everyone else, extend the courtesy to Labarbara as well. It IS a "team". We'll see what happens. I've already said enough about it.

Cristobal --

You're completely off-base. There's nothing even remotely "rant"-like in my comment. You made a comment about "honesty" (your example of honesty was Anthony). I commented in response to that. I said that just saying whatever pops into your head is not the same thing as honesty, except insofar as toddlers pitching a fit are being honest when they say they want a cookie. If you think that's "out of bounds" per Rich's policy, I'm willing to rephrase:

Your reactions seem hysterical and overblown.

re "the Kings haven't gone through any goalies? Really?":

JLB was pulled in game five. He's still the starting goalie. Nothing has changed. JLB was the starting goalie last year, too. Again, you seem to be making up your own little soap-opera and then railing against it.

Quisp, you wouldn't know about honesty in [sic] regards to the Kings because anything they do is ok with you. There's being realistic and there's being blind. For you, criticism equates to freaking out and throwing the team under the bus.

Honesty: let's follow the bouncing ball. You said Anthony was the only one being "honest" about Moulson. What you meant to say was, Anthony was the only one who agrees with you. My attitude about Moulson is "wait and see." You are the one making the discussion about Moulson into a split between honest and dishonest. It seems to me "honest" is not really the word you mean to use. But if you do mean it, it's insulting to those of us who disagree with you.

As far as "anything they do is okay with [me]", this is just an example of you trying to dismiss my opinions with a sweeping criticism that frankly you're just pulling out of your *ss. You have a problem with AEG and Lombardi, so they become the same to you, you have a problem with me, so I am suddenly just a shill, etc. etc..

I have been a Kings fan for 21 years, and there is a long list of things I have agreed with and disagreed with. You, meanwhile, as recently as a few weeks ago, were giving up on the Kings in order to be a Ducks fan. So you'll forgive me if I read your criticism of my honesty and/or loyalty to Kings players (since you seem to think I am pro-management) as hypocritical and absurd on its face. A joke, really.

For you, criticism equates to [sic] freaking out and throwing the team under the bus.

No, for me, freaking out equates to freaking out.

Quisp - The Kings have used at least 10 goalies since Lombardi came in. Cloutier was never worse than when he was in LA, and the same can be said of Garon. Didn't Labarbara win his first 9 games or so with LA at one time? Bernier has gone from the goaltender of the future to a 4 goals against question-mark.

Get your freak on.

Cristobal

When did I say to get rid of Barbs? I thought TM mader the right move in taking him out. I think he could have helped the team by making those saves in the 2nd period and bail out the atrocious plays made by Preissing and Zeus. He didn't make them and we lost. I didn't blame him for the defeat..I also can't say he played well.
He played great against San Jose in the 1-0 loss.
You're the one who keeps intimating that he's a mental midget who can't handle being pulled.

Blame the goalie coach...why??????
I can honestly say I have no idea what the hell the goalie coach can do for an NHL player...and I don't think you can either....and if by chance you can, then how do you know Ranford is not doing his job? These are things that we can only know by being at every single practice and watching what he does, and doesn't do with the goalies.
If we are going to blame him, then how do we account for the amazing turnaround that Ersberg did last year? After posting pedestrian numbers in Manchester, he lit the Kings world on fire with his play during the 2nd half.

They have "used" 12 goalies in the last two seasons, but you're missing your own point. Your point, which I will now paraphrase, is: the Kings have a problem with goaltending [p.s. I agree]; they are giving up on and/or psychologically damging Jason LaBarbera [p.s. I disagree]; there may be a problem with management and/or coaching [p.s. I disagree].

I wasn't saying they haven't used several goalies in past seasons. I was saying, they haven't "gone through" any goalies this season, which is what I thought we were talking about. I was saying, no one has given up on JLB, which is what you were asserting.

The reason the Kings have used so many goalies the past two years is, they don't have a legitimate, proven starter. Two years ago, the Cloutier mistake. Last year, LaBarbera sucked.

Your comment about Bernier going from goalie of the future to 4.00 gaa question mark is exactly what I'm talking about when I say you're being literally, clinically hysterical. He didn't "go from" being anything to anything else. He's not a question mark. It's just some b.s. you're making up and then railing against.

And while you're at it, leave my freak alone.

Quisp - Good job at not addressing what I just said and deciding what "we're" talking about.

Cristobal --

Thanks, man. For the record, I didn't "decide" what we were talking about. I said, "which is what I thought we were talking about." You can see the difference between clarifying what I thought we were talking about and telling you what we were talking about, I hope.

I thought I did I good job of addressing your comments. But let's go through them one-by-one:

The Kings have used at least 10 goalies since Lombardi came in.

Yes, we covered this point. See above.

Cloutier was never worse than when he was in LA, and the same can be said of Garon.

Your point is that had we shown faith in those guys, they would have performed? Cloutier had his shot and sucked. Surely that's not the fault of Ranford et al. Garon, never worse? Okay, I guess so. Garon is, if anything, LaBarbera-esque. I'm not crazy about either one of them. Garon wasn't playing under the best of conditions, but he didn't exactly play his ass off. I wouldn't say either Garon or JLB are "the answer." Nor would I blame them for the Kings' problems. Nevertheless, management thought that JLB was going to be the answer (at least for a few years until bernier can challenge), but despite the fact that he blew it last year, here he is again with a big vote of confidence from the GM and the coach. So I don't really see where your panic is coming from.

Didn't Labarbara win his first 9 games or so with LA at one time?

He has played extremely well in stretches. I don't remember the streak you're talking about, but it sounds familiar. If your point is, management should give JLB the nod, they already have.

Bernier has gone from the goaltender of the future to a 4 goals against question-mark.

He still is the future. I thought we covered that one, too. If there's some nuance of your comment that I am missing, please clarify.

Quisp - Maybe Ranford is spending too much time tossing tennis balls at him when he should put him on the ice with O'Sullivan and Brown shooting on him for an hour at a time.

The main reason for the number of goaltenders used over the last few years is injuries, plain and simple. All the injuries have only served to show how think the Kings were in that regard. Hopefully in the next year or so the position will become much more stable.

I do believe that some people get off on having other people react to them, so they'll say anything just to get a rise out of you.

deadcatbounce - i believe some people take other people commenting on hockey teams too seriously and start making personal judgements about people they don't even know.