Just Tribbin: If forced to pick the best darn top ten period, what can I say, I still like Charter Oak

I love it when people come together and share opinions, great blog, keep it up.

COChargerfan,

So NOW the discussion has evolved into projecting how individual players from each division will continue to develop and become NFL players? Ridiculous and NEVER a premise presented by ANYONE.

As to a couple points that are facts instead of opinions: How can you say 1-2 players a year is the *same* as most other schools when you yourself asked the question and Amat had 10 players presently on D1 rosters compared to CO's 2. That seems to be a significant statistical difference, and not "the same" as most other schools at all. It appears that YOU might be the one that doesn't understand statistics. That seems to be an easy one. Twist it for me please.

There has been NO teacher at Bishop Amat who was a baseball coach that was hired then "unhired" at CO... which you presented as a "true story". Were you wrong - or did you just lie. After so many glaring inconsistencies, now it's hard to determine.

I'll end this and put you out of your misery with some questions for you to consider.

You said your son was an AP/IB student. Why? Why would you have him take a "more challenging" schedule?

Would he be just as well off if he took a "basic" schedule and got a higher GPA?

Would that "basic" schedule prepare him for the next level as well as his AP/IB courses?

Is he "challenged" by the competition in his AP/IB courses on a daily basis more than he might be if he took that "basic" schedule you speak of?

Does he work harder and more seriously, knowing that at the end of the day he must take the AP tests and compete with students of that caliber on a national basis?

Since, as you said, as long as GPAs/SATs are equal, he is eligible for the EXACT SAME colleges as the next kid, isn't it to his advantage to take an easier course of study.

When all things are equal, what do YOU think college admissions officers use to break those ties?

Your a "college educated white male". Maybe you can do us a public service with your expert answers? As we say... we're waiting.

COChargerfan,
Number 11
Amat may not be the far ,far,far superior team but they will always take it to CO on the football field. Now that my friend is the far,far,far,far superior truth . Before you start I am not an Amat honk just a neutral observer who can see without hater glasses over his eyes. I THINK THAT IS WHAT THIS ARGUEMENT IS ALL ABOUT ANYWAYS ISN'T IT. Boy those Amat guys sure have you mezmerized , they are all you can think of from sun up to sun down. I have seen where you quote the Bible so being a Christian man I leave you with this , may God have pity on your soul and may he guide you to see the errors of your ways.

COChargerfan or twisted sister,
What part of no sat's or gpa's didn't you get. I am speaking of the basic classes it takes to graduate from each school and where those classes you were assigned or elected to take to get the diploma leave you when appling to a private or public university as far as meeting their entrance requirements. both students have a gpa of 3.0 and 1600 sat's and not a question of Amat's diploma carries more weight than CO'S that's your spin as you like to turn every post against you into your think to satisfy and justify your reply. Example being how many years of english is needed for the CO diploma and so forth. This time stick to the question not like in your last reply where you took off on the gpa,sat and then told me how I think. Just read and answer.

Joey, you missed the point on Jerry Rice...he was all-state in high school and was at a good program but obviously nobody saw him as being far, far, far superior because of his pedigree because he had ZERO college scholarship offers and would up at the D-II program, Mississippi Valley State University. And for every Jerry Rice there is a dozen high pedigree high school kids with D1 scholarships that fail in college as well as just as many success stories involving kids from D4, 5, 6, etc programs. The point is that despite your misguided argument, where a kid plays high school football (e.g. at the Pac-5 vs. the D7 level) does not determine their ultimate level of success.

On the Baseball Coach and education matters, now you've gone from twisted to really warped...read what is said and stop rationalizing the words to fit into something different from their obvious meaning. No matter how hard you try to turn the discussion around, in the end it is AMAT and ONLY Amat that is alleging football superiority to the SGV/IE and to boot, that the public education system is inferior...it is NOT ME, NOT CO or ANYONE ELSE saying the opposite so stop this nonsense because it is not working.

Joey, your question was easiest public school curriculum vs. easiest Amat curriculum and the answer is that the law requires that all public high schools provide each student with a college preparatory CURRICULUM…has nothing to do with individual students.

The truth is that I read this blog for two years without ever commenting but was always astounded by the common theme of the Amat Family banding together to diminish any accomplishment by a SGV school or blast someone that challenged their superiority assertions. So, I decided to put you guys to the test and from this we have learned the following truisms: (1) Amat honks exhibit narcissistic traits (2) The Transition Property that Amat honk routinely used to prove superiority doesn’t apply to sports (3) Compared to the SGV teams, Amat has not produced a far, far, far superior amount of college prospects, in fact, they only average 1-2 kids a year, which is the same as most of the other schools. (4) Amat honk doesn’t want to count the players at the Junior College level as evidence of the skill level of their program (5) Amat clings to the “D” marker to support their superiority claim but it has actually been abandoned by the CIF and is meaningless when comparing individual teams (5) Amat honk incorrectly uses the MaxPreps (and CalPreps) ranking of the Pac-5 DIVISION AVERAGE to support their superiority claims despite the disclaimers that they are not meant to be used in this manner…disclaimer states they are not to be used to evaluate the skill level of an individual team…so it is incorrect to use this AVERAGE to argue that a team in one division is automatically better than one in another division (6) Tiger is statistically 1% better than his next 10 rivals but Amat honk doesn’t understand statistics nor that close wins do not translate to far, far, far superiority and, instead, supports the proposition that minutely better is often all that separates winning from losing (7) Amat honks don’t think much of the public education system (8) Amat honks do not understand the college entrance requirements (9) Amat honks like to incorrectly insert people into a story that actually involves someone else…see Mr. Martinez…it is not him (10) Amat honks don’t like CONTEXT to get in the way of their twisted arguments

Amat honk, this information has been brought to the SGV as a public service announcement and does not have anything to do with CO.

WORTH REPEATING, you've got to be kidding me. A public school kid with a 3.0 GPA and a 1600 SAT score is eligible for the EXACT SAME colleges (i.e. JC and Cal States) as an Amat graduate with the same resume. You are dreaming if you think that just because the student is an Amat grad that this is good enough for "any university in America." A SAT score doesn't have a student's high school attached to it so why would this matter to a college admission board? And, where did you come up with the idea that there is a special Amat grad “weighting system” for college admission? In the real world, it doesn’t exist. The reality is that regardless of the high school one went to you need a 4.15 or better and 2000+ on the SAT to get into UCLA or Berkeley and all the top private schools require similar scores. Let me know where you find the supposed rules exception for Amat grads (I'm not holding my breath).

If you want to see what it really takes to enter the UC system, take at look for yourself at the following link:

http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/admissions/undergrad_adm/selecting/camp_profiles.html.

In the end, this is just another baseless Amat-ism that fails to pass real-world scrutiny.

COChargerfan,

Here's what YOU brought up. YOU wrote THIS this statement:
"...Here's a true story about that superior Amat education...about 15 years ago the Amat baseball coach/teacher left the school and was hired by CO...."

The point is Coach Martinez is the *only teacher* at Amat that coached baseball at Amat who left to go teach at Charter Oak".

THAT is what makes the story false.

And in the process you also wrote, ""So Amat superior education folks, how many of your teachers don't have college degrees, high school teaching credentials let along the masters degrees that are pretty much a prerequisite for all public high school teachers???"

Is that not questioning the education provided, and the qualifications of those who provide it? But you seem to feel that when you "defend" anything or anybody (remember coming to kh's rescue?) that absolves you from what you say but if Amat defends (or even someone NOT form Amat but supports the position) they are "Amat Honks" and subject to question.

So "opening that door" certainly can call into question the CO Principal and Asst Principal/AD (the same one you mistakenly alluded to being "unhired") - who I *praised* as being so well prepared during their time at Amat that they might someday bring CO up to that very same standard.

We've used all sorts of football examples back and forth. Most of which you ignore as they do nothing except disprove your contention. As to Amat's "occasional" big win... I guess you would have to play a team that would classify as a "big win". But you wouldn't know about that now, would you. You would first have to play someone that would fit into that category.

Since you are stuck on this figure - you just may be in the 1% of people who feel that Tiger isn't "far, far, far superior" than the rest of the field.. including the rest of the field.

By all means you can compare achievement in academics to achievement in other pursuits... including athletics. Several studies, among them the work by Benjamin Bloom on talent development compares academics, arts, and athletics among other pursuits. Achievement is acheivement. One of the best things about sports is the qualities it takes to succeed transcend sports into all areas of life... including academics.

The law may suggest that public high schools *offer* each student with a college preparatory curriculum... but whether they *provide* that to every student - or that every student take advantage of it is a whole 'nuther story isn't it. Certainly you're not suggesting that *every* student at CO graduates with record reflecting success in a college prep schedule? However that's the way it read - didn't it?

And sorry to hurt your feelings by pointing out ANOTHER mistake , but Jerry Rice (who I've met BTW) was All State at East Oktibbeha County High School which is "technically" his alma mater (it was renamed from BL Moor) and competes in Division 1A in MIssissippi ... the states LARGEST and most competitive division.

The trend here is that you're dealing in theoreticals what you suppose, or how it appears, instead of those "facts" that you are so looking for.

The bottom line is that you feel that CO is just a "good middle sized school" where I think they are a GREAT D7 program. I apparently have more confidence in your program than others associated with the school. I just feel that they can and should step out and play others (as La Habra has- a GREAT D5 program). Their kids deserve that opportunity. But as long as there are those like yourself who are content with beating teams inferior to yourself and settling for that as achievement - that won't happen.

Funny thing is, if you made me decide who my *second* favorite team in the SGV is - I'd have to say the Chargers (no offense to my friends elsewhere) Maybe more friends, family, alums, staffers, coaches, former, players than any other school. South Hills maybe not so far behind. I root for Felipe to turn it around because I had a few conversations with him when he was a player. Great kid. I respect the good programs. If you've been reading along for long enough (which you haven't) I coined the phrase right here, the "Farrar, Bogan, Gano Era" and how it has impacted Bishop Amat football. The "Hagerty Era" just may be the antidote.

As they say COChargerfan, if you can't build the tallest building you can make yours the tallest by tearing down the others. So keep trying to downplay the difference in divisions.. at least you can convince yourself. Be proud of being that GREAT D7 program. We'll work on being a pretty darn good D1 program for now - trying to get back to the top. I KNOW the difference....

COChargerfan??????
As posted on another tread. The real nitty gritty is Amat beats CO 9 out of 10 games with one tie because Big Lou considers a tie a win so he stops the game thinking he won. Now that it is settled everyting else is bs . But answer this, is a graduate of CO taking all basic classes eligible for entry to any university in America be it state or private . No need to worry about the Amat graduate because they are defintely eligible. No gpa's ,sat score just eligible. Do not put your twisted spin on this basic question. I am not Joe Amat so please put into laymans terms as you say when you speak down to the every day Joe so he can understand.

What's funny Joey is that I have an ear infection and can't hear very well...seems that you have indeed caught this illness.

More twisted Joey-isms.

Again, it was an Amat honk that brought up Martinez’s name and NOT ME. Think about it that even though he never sought the baseball coach position, you still want to insert his name into the story to prove it is fiction. Just because YOU are inserting the wrong person doesn’t make the story false and, instead, it just makes YOUR INTERPRETATION incorrect.

Sorry that you just don’t want to accept the Tiger analogy…it has validity to all sports, including football. That is, Tiger is statistically 1% better that the next 10 best golfers and is not at some outrageous FAR, FAR, FAR superior level, which is what Amat honk’s are arguing they are…the same can be said for successful football teams vs. mediocre ones. Ever heard of the importance of the takeover ratio to winning games…small detail (not some hugely different talent level) that adds up to wins or loses. And, remember that I did give you a football example…did we forget the little story about the Eagles, Colts, Giants and Titans patting themselves on the back because they beat the Super Bowl Champion Steelers during last year’s season…we compared it to Amat’s occasional “big win” makes us superior assertions.

Get the facts straight because I NEVER questioned the quality of the AMAT education…this is patently inaccurate. Instead, the Amat honks took shots at the public education system and I defended the teachers and administrators of the public education system as being more qualified than Amat’s because, unlike their counterparts at Amat, they are ALL credentialed and most have Master’s degrees. And I NEVER questioned the qualifications of anyone on CO’s staff, including the Principal and Vice Principal…this is just more twisted fiction from your lips…not mine…is that a conundrum Joey? Besides, what does this have to do with anything anyway…how many of Amat’s staff didn’t attend high school at Amat or attended a public high school or a public college? This so-called “conundrum” goes both ways Joey.

And, the law requires that all public high schools provide each student with a college preparatory curriculum…it is the private schools that aren’t subject to this same law. The same goes for the high school exit exam. My guess is that the college graduation rate of Amat grads is on par with the local public schools.

Joey, comparing the level of one’s educational training to football skills is apples to oranges. There are lots of pro athletes that have limited educations (very few ever earn college degrees) and, to be frank, many are sub-literate. There is no direct correlation between educational brainpower and the ability to tackle or chuck a football. And it appears that CO is going to have 4 kids move on to D1 College programs vs. Amat’s 1 kid…so using your logic this “basic” “D7” schedule is superior to Amat’s PAC-5/“D1 schedule.” But, the truth is that there is no correlation between an individual kid’s ultimate success and the “D” that they played high school football…I realize that this is contrary to your superiority argument but you need to learn to embrace the truth which is that a whole lot of college level kids come out of these “inferior” divisions and some even move on to pro greatness…for proof, look up Jerry Rice.

THe blog must have caught whatever ailment COChargerfan had.
COChargerfan you really do have it bad don't you? No not the illness - the complex. Here I was happy that you had a chance to sleep in... and you take it as a negative. You must just be a ray of sunshine to be around. The glass is half-full. buddy. Don't worry. Here's an old Irish saying.

""There are only two things in life to worry about: whether you are well or you are sick. If you are well, then there is nothing to worry about, but if you are sick there are two things for you to worry about: either you get well or you will die. If you get well, then there is nothing to worry about. If you die, then there are two things to worry about: either you go to heaven or you go to hell . If you go to heaven, then there is nothing to worry about. But if you go to hell, you will be so busy catching up with old friends you won't have time to worry."
You'll get better. Don't worry. Be happy.

Here's good rule of thumb (now where did THAT phrase come from?) Don't state as fact something you have no direct knowledge of. At least try not to preface that with "...true story..." Instead maybe try. "I heard this from a friend who was on CO's administrative staff..." (some friend!) Save your credibility... a bit.

You originally wrote "...Here's a true story about that superior Amat education...about 15 years ago the Amat baseball coach/teacher left the school and was hired by CO...."

I don't think anywhere did anyone (even you) write Coach Martinez was your baseball coachor was hired to *be a baseball coach*), but he is the only teacher at Amat that coached baseball who left to go teach at Charter Oak... unless you count your old child"hood" friend Richard Wiard, who led our freshman team (as did Coach Hagerty BTW) for a few years.

The only "true" part of your story was never mentioned in your original post. And the "true" part of the story has nothing to do with anything. Who cares if you had a conversation with a "a friend who was on CO's administrative staff..." What was pertinent to the story was the assertion - which proved to be entirely false. Did you read that closely?

And a degree isn't needed to coach baseball, otherwise you might take a walk out to your diamond and ask some questions (unless some things have changed recently I hadn't heard about... which I doubt)

The ability to "teach/coach" is hard to quantify... but I bet you know a good teacher/coach when you see one. That's what I want... in both. There is a far greater chance that a novice credentialed teacher comes in and performs subpar as an experienced uncredentialed teacher. Either way - you don't know until you see it. It's not the credential - it's the person. As you said, and I quote " Meeting these requirements doesn’t guarantee that someone will be a great teacher." I also happen to know a few people who have passed the bar that I wouldn't let represent my worst enemy. I'd definitely rather go to Shapiro's "LegalZoom.com" than have them try to present an argument. Here's some help too as to my Masters comments ... "most often" doesn't mean *all* - but there you go with your "translations", "interpretations", or reading between the lines.

You are so worried about "apples and oranges" yet you try use Tiger Woods to prove a football argument... which BTW came back to bite you no matter what way you look at it. Now you are trying to compare an AP/IB schedule at CO to a "basic classes" at Amat (whatever those are). Is that the way you want it? Are you sure? You can't put that genie back in th ebottle. More appropriate might be to compare AP/IB students at each school. The cream will rise to the top at both places. I know some excellent IB/AP students form CO very well and they would have fared well at Amat too. However, even more telling, and pertinent to most students, is to compare the *easiest* schedule Charter oak will allow you to take and the absolute *easiest* schedule Amat will allow you to take. Our kid meets college requirements... and yours? THAT is the real comparison. Will that kid in the "basic" classes at a private school be motivated by the "average kid" sitting next to him... or the "average kid" in the "basic" classes at a public school. You're judged by the company you keep. I know who I wanted MY kids sitting next to.

And here is where this one IS going to hurt, since I like your comparison so much. Here comes that "genie" that you let out of the bottle. So riddle me this Batman. Do YOU think the kid playing a football schedule at the highest level possible (IB/AP?) learns more about himself and has the greatest opportunity to improve... or a player at a school who plays a "basic" schedule? Would you say that an IB/AP (Pac5) schedule is far, far, far superior to a "basic" schedule? Or only 1% better? Inquiring minds want to know.

And no... I wrote conundrum... and absolutely meant conundrum. And this is certainly quite a conundrum. Like most issues we've seen here - you pick and choose. While the one definition you "chose" might be "-a question or problem having only a conjectural answer", others might be
-an intricate and difficult problem
-a riddle whose answer is or involves a pun
-a trick question, often involving a humorous use of words that have two meanings
-A kind of riddle based upon some fanciful or fantastic resemblance between things quite unlike; a puzzling question, of which the answer is or involves a pun.
-a puzzle or problem with a difficult or impossible solution.

And I think this certainly is a puzzling problem. You are questioning the education provided at Amat and those that provide it... yet they leave our school to become administrators and leaders at yours.Principal and Asst Principal/AD. Nothing exactly "contradictory" there (I could actually make a point by explaining it differently-but I'll cut you some slack since you're under the weather , but it does put you in quite a position, don't you think? That appears to be quite a juxtaposition. Inferior... leaders. Hhhmmm?!?

Now COChargerfan - you read like a pretty intelligent fellow, with all the "white educated male, IB/AP references, the research and definitions... quite a display. However, when you let your feelings get in the way you end up going right down that road you don't want to travel. My Friend - doesn't Chuck tell you're son that ll the time... don't let emotions get in the way of the debate!?!? I think it's that time for you, COChargerfan, to realize that discretion is the better part of valor and let it go. Look to your left... then look to your right... pssst... I think it's you.

and My Friend...that .... was.... Classic! "one of you thinks he's right and one of you knows he's right"!

Glad you and randy worked it out. As stated... most in here would. Nothing like a good debate. It's not personal. Never really is. This blog is just a big BBQ... alotta spirited "discussions" - just without the food & brew. Just be careful not to bite off more than you can chew!

I heard a great one this morning that applies to coaching, education, parenting, and maybe any level of communication.

"It does not matter what you say; it is what they say to themselves that counts. "

If I'm coaching. teaching, or just speaking to you, it would not matter what I said if you were repeating over and over in your head “Boy, he doesn’t know what the heck he is talking about.” Only after you're open enough to really listen and look at the facts objectively can change (learning) really occur. Or at least if it makes you say... Hhhhmmm!

Joey you've been told!!!!! lmao

COChargerFan I praying for you as I'm typing...lmao

I see we have a battle of Wit and Wisdom here...no offense ChargerFan but Joey has a tendency to blast away with facts while you are firing away with "don't you supposies"....this is going to hurt! JK...seriouly JK

My best guess is if randy and me can agree to disagree than I'm sure you two boys can as well.

joey...funny thing but "make ups" they are never the way the initiator thinks they're going to play out.

randy comes up to me at the game and says..."You look bigger in person than on the blog!"..I kid you not! LMAO

Then Joey as we're talking foootball I thought I'd put on a show..."and called 12 plays in a row!!"...old "SAFETY" trick my coach taught me....then when randy had that moment where he thinks..this is all BS...I tell him..."The "DRAW is next!' He says..."If teh next play is a draw i'll buy you dinner!...Joey..what can I say..."DRAW" LMAO...right on cue...he says..."How did you know? I said..."I was well coached"

Then the 2ndstring QB comes in for the last drive and his Dad a JV coach is standing by and I call out the "ROUTE" before the play starts...then to make sure he knows it's not guessing I tell him how I know and the "SEQUENCE" that gives the route away...finally the QB doesn't SEQUENCE and I tell them..."WHAT ROUTE...QUICK WHAT ROUTE???" they say..."I don't see one!"...and the kid RUNS THE BALL....Joey...you should have seen their faces....classic.

I just laughed...either way I told the Dad things that would only help his son..and I know his brother completely understood my intentions were to help his son..besides ...the kid had guts and can say he drove his team down the field to a score against the #1 team in the SGV. Pretty cool huh?

Joey and COFan I'm sure one of you thinks he's right and one of you knows he's right ( like randy and me)...thats why you dont agree to disagree...randy found out something I've said on here long ago...I was well coached and coaching matters....and just becaue yu don't agree or understand what I'm saying...don't mean I'm insulting you.

My guess is somewhere deep inside one of you it's annoyance that upsets you and not substance...randy didn't hate me because what I said was wrong but becau it irritated him that I was so sure of myself...hope that helps either way i'm glad that's over.

One more thing Joey...as the game ended Canales was walking to ay Hi and as I staryed moving towards him randy says.."You know him too?" I tell him."Yeah my brother dated his sister 32 years ago ..we're old friends and I actually played against him!"

Then as Canales is within hear hsot of randy I say...

"Joey...tell me it's kay to kick the crap out of randy!!!" Canales laughs and says..."Why would you want to do that?" and then shakes randy's and and says..."How's you son Randy?"

Guys it's a small world..is all I'm saying..have fun!!

Joey…so you can track my daily activities, I’m still sick and homebound after 5:00 am.

So, Martinez wasn’t ever the CO Baseball Coach and never even interviewed for the position…which was my understanding. Like I said, we aren’t talking about the same person, are we? More twisted stuff…the “true” part of the story is that it was told to me by a CO Administrator…again, I implore you to read my words carefully. I could get a name to settle this but that’s not my style to call someone out by name especially for something that is old news. It happened so live with it, pal. Same as the fact that Richard Wiard and I grew up in the same hood…are you still disputing that too?

Get the facts straight…I’m not kh’s bodyguard (he doesn’t need one because he can kick your rear anyway) but it was the Amat honks who took potshots at the public education system via comments that kh’s literacy is a product of it stating that he would be more literate if he went to Amat…as I clearly stated, the issue is Amat being superior to the “inferior” public education system. And what in a hill of beans do the travails of Amat vs. Ms. Wiard have to do with me…why do I even care…or Amat’s superior education assertions? Same can be said for why Ms. Wiard sends her kids to Amat…not relevant. Besides, has she personally told you why…I doubt it so you are just speculating as to the reason. Perhaps it is has nothing to do with Amat providing a superior education and, instead, is because of her faith. My own kids went to private Christian schools through 8th grade, which had nothing to do with the quality of education, and, instead, pertained to our desire for a Christian based perspective. Let me ask you this; is an Amat kid taking basic classes receiving a superior education to a CO kid in IB/AP classes? Obvious answer to most…what’s your answer?

There is always an amusing “Joey-ism” to explain away something that doesn’t fit your argument. Let me get this straight, it is less important for teachers to have college degrees and meet the stringent state credentialing requirements than to have classroom “production” skills (what exactly does production mean?). In the real world, it works the other way around Joey…you get a credential by going to college and earning an acceptable degree, passing the CBEST and CSET and doing one year of hands on student teaching and if and only if this is all done, this is EVIDENCE of one’s proficiency to teach both in terms of knowledge and the best methods to educate. For High School, there are additional requirement of having an undergrad or graduate degree in the subject that one teaches. Meeting these requirements doesn’t guarantee that someone will be a great teacher but insures that they meet the minimum QUALIFICATIONS that the Dept. of Education has set forth. A self-help legal company can produce the same legal forms that a lawyer can but if you want someone to teach you the intricacies of the law, are you going to a paralegal clerk or a lawyer with a J.D. and license? Why do you think licenses are required for many, many professions? Remember the context is that Amat honks were saying that the public education system is inferior to Amat and my counter is that this is hogwash considering that ALL the CO teachers have credentials and most have Masters in their chosen subject and Amat can’t say the same thing. And Joey, all teachers don’t get advanced degrees just to make more money and besides, an individual’s reason is irrelevant to our discussion…what matters is that they have the degrees which makes them more educated and implicitly more knowledgeable in the subject that they teach. So, are you saying that more expertise in your profession isn’t relevant?

Again, the discussion is that Amat honks believe that the public education system is inferior. The truth is that the vehicle to get an education exists equally at both private and public schools and the education level of an individual is a function of their God given intelligence and dedication to learning…so an Amat education is superior is another example of their narcissistic personality driven superiority assertions.

Finally Joey, if you are going to drop big words like “conundrum” please know what it means. Here’s Webster’s definition; “a question or problem having only a conjectural answer” and “conjecture” is “a solution deduced by surmise or guesswork.” So, what exactly do I need to understand regarding a question or problem with an answer that can only be deduced by surmise or guesswork?

Here’s some help because, after all, I’m still your conscious…the word you were looking for was “contradiction.”

Joe...you freakin moron...how many times do I have to tell you...if you want to be a member in the far far superior club you can use all the powers at your disposal: facts, logic, reason and wit but never ever never ever put someone in the "conundrum"!!!!

Joey I must say...you are a wicked task master my friend..wicked to the bbbbbboooooonnnnnneeeee!

conundrum....classic!!!!

too funny....

So are you in the habit of repeating things that you heard and restating them as ***"true stories***" when you have no FIRST HAND knowledge. (your exact words were , "here's a *true story* about that superior Amat education...") Had no one called you on it many may have read that and assumed it was fact. "True story"? Tough to get a "retraction" after the fact. Glen Martinez was the Amat baseball coach from the mid '80s when Mark Parades vacated the baseball program to take over the football team. Martinez remained the head coach until 1996 he left for Charter Oak, when Ken Kendrena took over ... and he was the baseball coach until he left in 2006 to join baseball's Inside Edge and Nieto took over. You do the math. In a court of law that ruins ALL of your credibility now - doesn't it? Should we stop there..

That comment regarding the Principal was not "out of the blue" but in a *direct response* to your statement regarding the Amat's faculty and the education that students are receiving from teachers. There's nothing OBVIOUS about your between the lines interpretations. It would only be OBVIOUS to one with a complex such as yours. If you really knew the Wiard's instead of just claiming to have lived a few blocks away form Mr. as a kid, you'd know how that all went down. Many of us were irate... so no cannibalism at all. Simple fact. She wanted the job. Publicly applied and had a lot of support. Couldn't get it (thanks to our "leader" MSGr Carroll) who handled it terribly, made an awful announcement in our alumni newsletter, she was angered enough to look to leave. Fact. And good for her. But you must find it interesting that HS administrators at Charter Oak continue to send their kids to Bishop Amat. Why would you think that is? Read between those lines for me.

And while you're defending the quality of the public education and athletic program it is being guided by leaders prepared at Amat. So for you to question how they were prepared would kind of defeat your purpose, would it not? Quite a conundrum - don't you think?

So now you've appointed yourself kh's knight in shining armor and you're going to come to his rescue after someone *responds* to his post about private education vs going to the "local school"... in only a way that kh can? Remember, "when you respond...." or are those rules only for you?

And as to "California Teaching Credentials" and the "Masters" degrees that you say are "...pretty much a prerequisite for all public high school teachers..." (untrue and most often a method simply to move up the pay scale). To be perfectly honest, I happen to look at those "degrees" as far less important than the work that's going on in the classroom. I've seen plenty of coaches that go to a bundle of clinics and can't coach their way out of a paper bag just as I see "credentialed" teachers that can't manage a classroom. I want to see production. I suppose it's similar to your determining someone as "achieving" their goal by winning some "big game" as opposed to the actual process of becoming the best one can be. But maybe that's just me. Or not.

COChargerfan ???????,
Ok we understand you are the conscience of Amat. But just like in the cartoons and movies when they show the little angel on one shoulder and the little devil on the other we have come to realize you are the little devil. We prefer to listen to the little angel who says be the better person and try to help that little devil and show him the errors of his ways. Much like you feel you doing for Amat. So basically we have come to a standstill. Give it a rest now as it is now becoming the famous moot point. To each his own and now that league play is starting put your focus into rooting for you team if in fact you do root for them and save all this for that day when we finally settle eveything where it should be settled. On the field .

Joe Amat, thanks for another twisted response.

To start, I have two questions...what years was Mr. Martinez Amat's head coach and was he ever the head coach of CO's baseball team? Unlike every other question that I have previously posed to you, I really don’t know the answers to these questions but would like to know. Back to the facts, I NEVER said that it was Mr. Martinez that did not have a college degree only that someone on the CO Administrative Staff at that time told me the story about an Amat teacher who went to CO for a baseball/teaching job. This story was told to me and I repeated it but I never said that I had FIRST HAND knowledge of the facts…that is your wrong assumption. And, I have no desire to find out the person’s name so that I can post it on this blog…not my style to call people out especially since this is something that is very old and irrelevant news. Is it not possible that we are talking about two different persons?

Come on, the comments about Ms. Wiard were OBVIOUSLY made to prove her unworthiness to run Amat...why else was such out of the blue sky nonsense even needed to be brought up? Wake up Joey it is what it is…eating your own. And for the twisted portion of the show, it was Amat honks that leveled the inferior rap on the quality of the public education system via blasts at kh’s public education, not me. Remember CONTEXT Joey…I’m defending the public system and the quality of education provided by dedicated individuals such as the Wiards and it is the Amat honks that called them inferior…get it straight pal.

And I never said that I have an ongoing friendship with the Wiard’s only that I grew up a block away from Richard, which I can assure you is true, and that I know about the Wiard’s background…again, your wrong assumption and not one of my mistakes, which you obviously work very hard to try to find.

As you have noted on several occasions, I choose my words carefully so do me a favor and please take the time to READ them carefully.

So, since you brought it up again, could you dig into your vast databank and then let us know exactly what percentage of Amat’s faculty have a California High School Teaching Credential? As you like to say, take your time in getting back to me with this answer (p.s., I'm not holding my breath!!!).

COChargerfan,

I don't see any derogatory comment about CO's principal character's by saying that she wanted the Amat Principal job but they wouldn’t hire her. That was 100% the truth and nowhere did I READ that "she was not qualified…err, smart enough."

Now, again, you may try to READ between the lines to try to find what you're looking for. What was written was " She couldn't get the Amat Principal job - so she went to CO". If you know the family so well (because you grew up a few blocks from her husband) go ask how ticked she was (as were many) on how MSGr handled the Principal search and if that wasn't the impetus in her leaving to take the CO job. No implications at all.

The reason that Coach Martinez was relevant is because YOU stated (not insinuated) that the baseball coach hired away from Amat about "15 years " ago (which was Glen) then "unhired him" for not having a degree or credential. YOU wrote that - I didn't read between any lines.

After YOU wrote that your "true story about that superior Amat education" You wrote, "So Amat superior education folks, how many of your teachers don't have college degrees, high school teaching credentials let along the masters degrees that are pretty much a prerequisite for all public high school teachers???

After that statement I think it was very significant that the CO Principal and Athletic Director actually have deep Amat roots and the "baseball coach 15 years ago" story was completely off the mark. The leaders of your school and athletic department cut their teeth at Amat. Still inferior? Better not be... for your schools sake.

Hey “One big happy family”, Richard Wiard and I grew up one block away from each other so I know who he and his wife are...you know what they say about "assuming" something without any idea of the facts? I was also aware of Mr. Martinez's background but what exactly does this have to do with anything anyway? What you missed is that one of your own leveled a derogatory comment about Amat alum Ms. Wiard’s character by saying that she wanted the Amat Principal job but they wouldn’t hire her insinuating that she was not qualified…err, smart enough…for the Amat job but was for the position at the inferior public school, CO. Talk about eating your own offspring.

Pay attention YOU NEED IT MORE, I’m Amat honk’s conscious…and your conscious never sleeps!!! Seriously, it is obviously not just me standing on the soapbox so it goes both ways…if honks like Joe Amat would let it go so would I but they can’t so the conscious wakes up everyday around 5:00 am and chimes in so we can all have a nice day. And, per Amat honk, that’s a weak IE team that is part of CO’s soft schedule so what is there to celebrate? (AMAT 73 and just sayin’…that’s an example of tongue in cheek so don’t come back at me with some twisted response)

COChargerfan,
Rather then coming on here and praising your team for a great come from behing win you would rather continue your obsession with Amat. Man those Amat guys really are all you can think of . You come on here at 5 in the morning and the first thing you do is start your day with Amat. I guess you have your own version of the Amat fight song the sun comes up the moon goes down Amat is always on my mind. Lighten up dude this is only a blog and not to be taken as your personal soap box to straighten the out the Amat bloggers. Since you could care less about the CO football team's win I would like to congrats on a great come from behind win and way to rep the SGV against the ie. Good job Chargers.

worst video ever

COChargerfan

There you are! You got quiet after learning that Charter Oak's principal and athletic director are both Bishop Amat graduates and spent the vast majority of their careers at BA.

Welcome back!

I have video for you. This is what your stadium looks like after you knock off the 2 time defending State champion:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqWgRmcNRU0

Enjoy!

COChargerfan, most of you’re posts would be pretty much on the mark if it weren’t for all the soap box stuff that you seem to enjoy throwing out there all the time.

If you started to post stuff that was objective and not continually confrontational, then you might see that there may very well be more than a handful of Amat bloggers that would agree with you every now and then in here. However, you’re takes seem to always be on issues that rarely if ever, have anything to do with sports in general, and maybe that’s why so many of the folks who read you’re stuff, just blow you off all the time.

You know COChargerfan, sometimes I don’t even think that you even go to the Charter Oak football games because if you did, then you would at lest, had something positive to say about you’re teams performances every now and then.

I guess that instead of talking football, you have decided to come in here and talk about religion and how people ought to live their lives. In fact, you even throw in what so and so said in the blog yesterday for good measure.

Really, COChargerfan, you should learn to lighten up because in the end you need to ask yourself this one question. What does all of that have to do with football ?

I hope our guys didn't do that. You guys are still bums, but I hope that didn't happen.

I’ve been reading this thread for amusement because I’m not into mythical whose better comparisons and note you Amat honk’s narcissistic attacks on your new enemy SGV FOOTBALL, but couldn't overlook commenting upon AMAT 73’s hilarious statement that "I also don't think anyone of us has ever written we are the best of the SGV." Come on, Amat honks have written this maybe 100 times over the past year…what exactly does Amat’s claim to being FAR, FAR, FAR SUPERIOR to the SGV teams mean to you? And Geez Lance Amat, you need some serious psyche counseling for that paranoia because the whole world is not a hater that is out to get you. Stop looking over your shoulder pal because no one is really following you…it’s all in your head. Do you ever find yourself typing over and over the words “All work and no play makes LANCE AMAT a dull boy?”

If Amat and CO played, no doubt that Amat would be heavily favored and rightfully so but is it impossible that CO could win, especially if they got a 91-yard return and 84 yard interception for touchdowns? Could happen Amat honks, couldn’t it?

I wasn’t at the CO game last night but if it’s true that some BA players were in the stands chanting overrated then congratulations you’ve got a bunch of classless, obnoxious kids on your team. Does Hags teach this behavior? Way to represent your values.

Let's make it an even 100 !!!!!

You were spot on on that CO defense Fred. They sure putting the stops on Etiwanda and Muema is tearing their defense apart. Remember it is too late for a retraction on your pick.

If anyone is watching LB Poly play Lakewood, remember St Bonnies dominated those guys. Wow!

Joe Amat,

I hear what your saying.

SGV - Are you not the author of this assinine statement,
"Hags doesn't need confidence to go into the St. Bonnie, LB POLY, ND, O LU, because he knows that if they lose its okay!" *** WHAT? No its not Okay to lose. Maybe that's what they preach over at CO but not at Amat. Obviously you can't win them all but you never go in with a ridiculous attitude like, that's okay, cause we were supposed to get beat anyway......

"the kids and the programs of the three teams obviously didnt think much of the BA kids and program" *** NO! Thats just for local guys who are pissed off and harboring a deep seeded hatered towards the school they didn't get to attend because their parents sent their other siblings instead.

"They were supposed to beat Amat?" Amat was not the favorite against St. Bonnie, LB POLY and O LU, thats why they were projected to beat BA. Now you tell me how this makes me a BA "hater". *** taken out of context. I stand corrected in regard to this BUT You're still an Amat Hater even if you throw an occassional bone.

You guys get mopped up by Amat this year. Keep them rose colored glasses on!

Lance Amat,
I think what SGV said was somewhat correct in the eyes of our opponents and others such as the ones listed.Really SB was listed as 24 point favorites going into the game by many and the perception was they would walk all over us but as you say we think different about that. I don't agree with the "Hags doesn't need confidence" part because I know it's not ok to lose to them for Hags or lose to anyone else because if he thought like that how could he sell his team on the fact that they can beat anyone who steps on the field against us . We believe we can beat everyone like you state. I also don't think anyone of us has ever written we are the best of the SGV. Yes many of us say we will beat them all ( maybe that's what gets us in trouble or hated so much) but I don't think we write that we are the best , that is them saying we say it not us. I have seen many posts by SGV FOOTBALL and I do think he understands and means well, but misguided on the confidence part. Cut him a little slack, afterall his sister is a LANCER and his Dad does sport the AMAT and not the CO decal on his window .

u no who u r, call me back, we got disconnected, i leave for the La Habra/San Clemente game at 6

SGV FOOTBALL,

FYI, The Serra league has been the top ranked league in the Pac5 (the top ranked division) for a few years now - and continues to be so today.

http://calpreps.com/2009/ratings/California_leagues.htm

Not arguing much of what you say, about the Lancers last few years, but I can guarantee you that something you wrote a bit earlier. While those prognosticating may project a win for someone - that doesn't always reflect what is believed in the locker room or the coaches office. And that's what really counts. The coaching staff was VERY confident going into the St Bonaventure game, and felt the same in every game last season. THAT'S how you prepare kids to eventually believe.

They're getting there.

Lance Amat,

Are you serious what you described is what every team with a decent program goes out onto the field with every game, its not just Amat. I will say it again my sister graduated from amat. My dad still has his BA sticker on his truck and i have my CO sticker. I have no hate for them i dont even hate dranch, but when you bring up the point that amat is the best, we all know that is not true. When the CO vs BA topic gets brought up I love to start up the fire. You will never here my say that I want BA to lose unless its to CO. In your words "Obviously you are a local public school guy because over here at Amat, NOBODY! is ever SUPPOSED TO BEAT US!!!" If you ever decide to get off your pedestal you will realize that if no one is suppose to beat you then why hasn't BA competed for a league title in years not CIF just league. Please dont tell me your league is the toughest either, because currently the sunset league and the trinity league are two tough leagues to compete in. To answer your question about "They were supposed to beat Amat?" Amat was not the favorite against St. Bonnie, LB POLY and O LU, thats why they were projected to beat BA. Now you tell me how this makes me a BA "hater".

I just read a great article on the la times check it out.
http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-sondheimer9-2009oct09,0,2201792.column

SGV FOOTBALL - The more I read from you, the more I'm beginning to believe that, despite your double edged compliments, you are also a true Amat Hater. They were supposed to beat Amat? Obviously you are a local public school guy because over here at Amat, NOBODY! is ever SUPPOSED TO BEAT US!!! There goes that mind frame that Amat guy is always talking about. That state of mind that makes you guys love to hate us for! You outsiders just - don't - get - it!!! Call it arrogance. Call it a false sense of security. Hell call it whatever you haters want to call it but when an AMAT FOOTBALL team steps on the field of battle we only imagine coming off one way - VICTORIOUS!!! Go Big Blue!

SGV FOOTBALL,
Good post with just one exception. It is not bad news for AMAT because that is the standard where we wanted to be at all along.

Red Bull Rush,

Maybe if you were to use your brain and think before you speak, and not talk out of your a$$ you would know that anytime there is two local teams that are rivals you know both will bring their A game. The reason why I say confidence is because Hags knows that if BA loses to Co it means a little more than just a number in the loss column. Thats why when BA played Damien or West Covina it was close, not because they are that good, because it was a local rivalry game. Even if they beat BA I would still consider BA better than Damien and W Covina. Hags doesn't need confidence to go into the St. Bonnie, LB POLY, ND, O LU, because he knows that if they lose its okay! Why because those teams are supposed to be better than BA. The reason why BA has beat O Lu and Bonnie and kept it close with LB Poly is because the kids and the programs of the three teams obviously didnt think much of the BA kids and program. Now BA has set the standard and no one will over look them, which is bad news for Bishop. All I want from BA this week is to see is a 42-7 victory over Pomona Ranch.

CO You Know.

This kid is a sophomore and playing on the Varsity team. This is his Freshman video. He will be unstoppable next year as a Junior...

http://nationalunderclassmen.ning.com/video/zachary-shay

SGV FOOTBALL,

"Hagerty has some confidence he can beat CO"

wow...just when I thought I'd heard everything....

SGV FOOTBALL...any thought on Haerty's confidence going into the St. Bonnie's Game? how about LB POLY? ND? O LU?

I think you're wrong about Hagerty's confidence level...maybe if he scheduled USC and beat them in a preseason scrimage...maybe then Hagerty would have the "confidence"...because you need lots of that...to play CO...wow is that silly of what?

Fred, keep up the good work.

When does the Santiago or Thorapay Thread come up...I'm dying to see where that goes!!!

Farrar is not going to schedule BA next year. BA will have Jay Anderson, Zachary Shay,Wallace Gonzalez, a massive and experienced OL, and the most athletic QBs in the San Gabriel Valley in Rio Ruiz.

BA will crush CO next year. This game is not going to happen.

RAMPAGE!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44JMjaKEasE

I need to set the record straight, some of the uneducated BA fans (not all of them some of them)are saying that When CO played BA back to back, that in 04 and 05 that was CO's up years and BA low years. This was not one of their up years, they were mearly on an average year. As the result at the end of the year was being booted out second round of the playoff in 04 and in 05 by the same team. Just like Amat 73 said, this game would be a sell out if played at a neutral field like mt sac. I do see this game happening next year, I feel Hagerty has some confidence that he can beat CO next year, and will push big Lou to set it up. Also this time administration will not get involved.

The Tribune can't sell newspapers, but Fred certainly knows how to sell a blog....just add Amat and CO and tell us the most dumbest thing that could happen if you put these two teams together.

Either, Fred does not understand Amat's winning tradition against local SGV teams (regardless of their record) or he is so smart to defy logic and common sense that he will sell his soul to the devil to sell this blog. I am settling for the latter. Keep up the good work Fred, who else would create controversy? Hell, controversy sells...Look at Maddona and Brit Spears.

Personally I think it is quite insulting to the Amat faithful to put CO in the same breath as Amat and this is coming from an Non-Amat fan...Amat is in a whole different Class of it's own and they have more than proven this over time to all the rest in the SGV, this is why there is so much envy and resentment. Their rabid and crazy fans is what makes this blog so much fun and entertaining. If it weren't for Amat, these blogs would be very boring indeed.

CO will come and say well we won CIF...well that's like saying your kid made the Dean's list at ITT or Bryman's College.

That video of the dawg pound emptying onto the field after the extra point was classic.

When was the last time, if ever, that happened? It wasn't in the OT game against St. Paul because the final play was on that side of the field.

Most of you Amat fans are azzholes! Just because one person has an opinion you ppl come all unglued. Some numb nut posts that there is no way CO a D6 team can EVER beat a team like SB. ROFLMAO! Then we have the Amat faithful who are still holding on to two games played four or five years ago, Fred did not say CO had a better program then CO. He is just stating an opinion, and you Amat ppl cannot handle it! To think that a CO team could EVER beat Amat is heresy! Un-fricking believable! You are correct that CO may only win D6 championships but at least they do win championships, you jerk offs aint done jack in years. I don’t care that you play in the best division in the country, you are still bottom feeders and your fans are worse!

I know of a team called the chonkers that would get beat 180-0 or worse by Amat n vice versa.

WOW!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44JMjaKEasE

crowbars? that writer must have visited la puente before.

RIOTS @ BISHOP AMAT!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44JMjaKEasE

So was it worth it Fred?

Now instead of celebrating Bishop Amat representing the San Gabriel Valley with a huge national news win we are left with bloggers tearing BOTH programs down.

From the outside looking in this must make OC and IE bloggers bust out laughing at us.

I imagine some St. Bonnie's fans checking in on Bishop Amat on Fred's blog and thinking...are you kidding me...we lost to that community?

This is going so well Fred .....so the Tribune's theory is to pick any school with enough success to create a WWE type feud with the Eveil Empire Bishop Amat in an effort to sell papers...classic!

Vince Mac Mahon would be proud!

Yeah but that's only after Maxpreps wrote that National article about Charter Oak winning the Division VII Champions... oh wait, they didn't? Well they must have written one about them tying Rancho Cucamung... no? Going undefeated in that powerhouse Miramonte Lea... nada? How about that big win in the 3 o'clock game vs Univerver... nothing? OK, they did get national coverage on that yearbook episode, so that's good for something - right?

amat is far superior when it comes to football these kids practice and train at a different level from the rest of the "top 10" since their summer after 8th grade graduation. many will agree

AMAT MADE THE MAXPREPS NATIONAL HEADLINES!!!

http://www.maxpreps.com/news/iOql_rN5Ed6OEwAcxJTdpg/california--johnson,-special-teams-make-bishop-amat-a-special-team.htm

outstanding...simply outstanding.

Maxpreps dude says...

"Although beaten in the first round of the Pac-5 playoffs, Bishop Amat lost to Long Beach Poly, 21-17. Given that Poly (14-1) went on to win the section title with a senior-laden team, maybe one of us experts should have figured on the Lancers doing some damage in 2009. It appears they showed up with crowbars."

HAHAHAHAHAHAA!!! I seriously like this MaxPreps writer!!!!

Unbelievable...Maxpreps wrote an article on Bishop Amat...

MAXPREPS WROTE A ARTICLE ABOUT LA PUENTE'S BISHOP AMAT!

you forget - DR has no home. they borrow their big brother Ganesha's home in SinTown when they aren't using it - or aren't lending it to their other big brother, Pomona. That's why they're stuck playing on Saturday night.

Let's do something seriously sick and demented and interview both administrations past and present especially former Bishop Amat employees that now are currently employed by Charter Oak and ask them their opinion and insight to this entire debate.

I for one hate so much of this hearsay and would much rather FredJ search for the TRUTH! I guarantee you that administrators new and old have answers to our questions and this argument. Don't be afraid of this heated topic and run and hide from this story but instead confront and deal with this really at this point we may and almost call this a fight and finally find a resolution.

Writers are fact finders and am done and over this back and forth nonsense and would much more prefer a settlement that can be had by talking to the powers of be and getting them to take a stand and then let the record show from there. All in favor? I..!

Recipe 4 upset?
bishop letdown after big win.
DR hungry and home.

California: Johnson, special teams make Bishop Amat a special team

Speedy return specialist helps Lancers knock off St. Bonaventure.
Wednesday, October 07, 2009
By: Martin Henderson
MaxPreps.com

Darien Johnson, Bishop Amat
La Puente Bishop Amat hasn’t been relevant as a large school power for years, but the Lancers rode back into the limelight Friday when they upstaged Ventura St. Bonaventure, 24-23, in overtime.

It ended a 14-game winning streak by St. Bonaventure (4-1), which had been a favorite to advance to a third consecutive State Bowl game. Of course, the Seraphs – the two-time defending Division III Bowl champion – can still get to the Home Depot Center if they win the Southern Section Northern Division title.

But of greater note is Bishop Amat, which is now 4-0 with a victory over one of the most highly regarded teams in the state. It’s a bit like Huntington Beach Edison beating Anaheim Servite two weeks ago, except more surprising.

It is the signature moment in Steve Hagerty’s two years as coach. Anyone who saw that result coming is wearing a jersey with Nostradamus lettered on the back.

The Lancers were 7-4 under Hagerty last season and finished more than two games over .500 for the first time since the 2001 team went 9-2. Between 2001 and 2008, Bishop Amat was 44-37 and never got past the second round of the playoffs.

Although beaten in the first round of the Pac-5 playoffs, Bishop Amat lost to Long Beach Poly, 21-17. Given that Poly (14-1) went on to win the section title with a senior-laden team, maybe one of us experts should have figured on the Lancers doing some damage in 2009. It appears they showed up with crowbars.

Quarterback Jerry McClanahan returned from that team, as did defensive back Darien Johnson who seems nothing short of the real deal. Johnson has returned two kickoffs, a punt and an interception for touchdowns this season.

In the victory over St. Bonaventure, Johnson returned a kickoff 91 yards and an interception 84 for scores. Junior Jay Anderson carried 26 times for 108 yards and a one-yard touchdown in overtime, which set up Alexander Ragsdale’s game-winning point-after.

It was a big night for Bishop Amat’s special teams. After St. Bonaventure scored on its possession in overtime, Davis Cazares blocked the extra-point attempt. That set the stage for Ragsdale to make good after missing a 42-yard field goal in the fourth quarter.

The last time Bishop Amat won a section title was 1995, when Tom Salter’s squad beat Los Angeles Loyola, 14-10, in the Coliseum. It had reached the final in 1994 only to lose to Santa Ana Mater Dei, 28-21, at Anaheim Stadium.

With the victory over St. Bonaventure, Bishop Amat seems poised for a return to glory. If the Lancers really are a player, then the Pac-5 playoffs just got a little more crowded. First, though, the Lancers must get through the stout Serra League that includes Sherman Oaks Notre Dame, Encino Crespi and Loyola.

A 1980 graduate Bishop Amat, Hagerty was let go in 2006 by Riverside Poly after going 10-27-3 over four seasons. He also had coached at Riverside North and Lancaster Paraclete. At Paraclete, he inherited a program that had not won a game in seven seasons but won three consecutive section titles under Hagerty’s reign.

When he arrived at Bishop Amat he had a career record of 88-61-3. If his team beats Pomona Diamond Ranch (1-4) on Saturday, it will be Hagerty’s 100th victory.

It will take some doing to top No. 99.

Inside Amat,

Your wrong in one fact and that is It was Big Lou that wanted out of the contract and not Mr Martinez. Therefore Mr Marinez was an extension of Big Lou and had them get out of the contract for the CO programs sake

OUCH! I CONCUR

first of all, if all you of you charter oaks fans knew anything. Amat and charter oak used to play each other, we had a three year contract with charter oak and every level for the first 2 yrs blew away charter oak. The 3rd yr Mr. Martinez at charter oak begged amat to get out of the contract which we did due to embarrasment to the kids and their families, so charter oak will never be in the same category as amat, plain and simple. So CO get a clue, you will always be division 7 and that's the only way you will win any CIF Championship.

The 'stupidity" on Fred's part is in asking the question less that a week after Amat pulls off one of the biggest upsets in CIF history. Amat loses Price and others and seals a bigger win than last year's O Lu comeback? come on that's "stupid" and I'd say the same thing to Fred and he knows it...

I'm a big fan of Fred's but when he does this "now" it's stupid because it does three things that disrespects everyone.

first is infers that CO could do the same...how can you even entertain that?

second it minimizes St. Bonnie...so now national polls are suspect and SB's team is teh "worst in ten years"?

third it creates anomosity for teh sake of hits...that's being lazy

so Fred in all fairness to you and anyone else that was offended...ever go to a funeral and someone asks...so who's getting "his"..."HIS" BEING THE MAN IN THE BOX... car?...while tHE man isn't even in the ground...what does everyone say..."That's being stupid!"

Timing is everything and in this case it's plain stupid to suggest that after Amat beats the #3 team in the state and the #17 team in the USA that CO could do likewise. Heck CO could even beat the #1 team in the IE in two tries!!! LOL

Why not give CO it's due and Amat their due...I like CO and respect BA...there is a difference...when Amat goes 5-5 and CO goes 5-5...is there a difference?

Figre that out and tell me if that's not stupid.

Amat's frosh team was leading 42-0 at the half against Diamond Ranch. But the difference is that we put in our 2nd, 3rd and 4th stringers and still scored 7 more points... Final Score 49-0...this game could have easily been 90-0 but we showed some respect and mercy on Anonypuss's frosh team.

I wish our Frosh team could play CO frosh or JV, so we could also put an ass whooping on those trash talking morons......

King Stud, it's not trash. It's the truth. No matter how you spin it, I'm telling the truth. It might not be the most humble stance, but CO is not in the same class as Amat, period! And, I'm not concerned about Anti-Amat sentiments in the slightest bit. Also, it's not MY ego as I have never spoken of MY exploits. And if you really read my posts, you'd know that I'm really saying their athleticism should lead to playing tougher people. But maybe ole Lou knows something we don't, like they can't or don't like to compete. So, again, CO's program is nothing like Amat's and they play bums, case closed!

Fred I agree with you. I think Charter Oak would beat Amat as well. If only because the Amat fans will be too busy arguing over something on the internet to actually cheer or root their team on.

Controversy sells. Fred I love the moxie but I have to agree with the Amat honks that I don't believe that CO would beat Amat. Is it possible the game would be competitive? Yes. You have to give it to Fred he knows how to get hits on the blog.

The Amat fans are right when they say playing the best helps a team not only during pre-league but during the league and playoffs and CO hasn't been playing tough teams. Keep in mind it's also hard to compare a Div 1 team to a team thats in a lower division like CO.

Now Franky stooping to a new low calling Fred stupid? This coming from someone who has a hard time spelling the word THE? Does anyone seen the irony here?

Please can you check your ego at the door? It's comments like yours that help promote the Anti-Amat sentiment that guys like Joe Amat and Amat 73 try to squelch. Amat is a good program but there is no need for that kind of garbage.

We crush those bums on COACHING and PROGRAM alone. Never mind that our gamers play against big boy competition, COACHING and PROGRAM win the game. You know what Johnson, Anderson and the rest would do, that's easy. But what you bums from CO don't understand is that it's the PROGRAM that wins for Amat. You'll never understand it because you don't possess it. You possess some decent athletes who aren't coached up. I really thought Muema was special. It turns out, he doesn't perform well against guys that are as athletic as he is. CO, that's the difference between your studs and our studs. OURS PERFORM AGAINST THE VERY BEST HS FOOTBALL HAS TO OFFER! Maybe your coach should come to an Amat clinic to learn how to build a PROGRAM!

Fred,
Please tell me what is a Chager. For a minute I thought you said CO Chargers but since you say the Chagers maybe they can beat Amat .

I should have clarified,
I meant any CO team of the past ten years.

To:Joe Amat
How could you call Charter Oak beating AMAT an upset. That is in no way shape or form an upset. I've seen both teams play this year,across the board CO has more athletes than AMAT, and many will attest to that statement. But the one thing that AMAT has that CO doesn't and that is Darien Johnson, that kid is in a league of his own. I agree with you that AMAT would win if the game was ever played.

I don't think CO. is as good as last year without Williams, Perry and Allen, but Amat isn't as good either without Bowen, Price, Gaise, Prieto, Maffie, and Seals. Remember that they had all those guy's plus Anderson, Johnson, and Mc Clahnahan. I still think Amat swarms to the ball quicker and I may be wrong but they give me the impression that their fundamentals and techniques are a bit more sound than most teams, I don't see them dropping balls or missing as many tackles as other teams. I'd pick last years CO team with Allen and the two bookends over this years Amat team but I would also pick last years Amat team over any CO team.
As for the Damien poster who compared the WC game vs Amat to the Damien game vs Amat, both games were tight and you have to consider that WC was very injured and still hung tough with Amat. I don't know how missing 4 key starters and 6 positions affects your program
but it makes a difference at West Covina, three of those 4 starters missing for the Amat game were three year varsity players and the 4th is a very skilled player too, Venice was even worse with more positions missing.
I'm not saying we are better than Damien or even South Hills, but keep in mind that no one has seen WC at full strenght yet, lets see what happens as WC gets healthier, especially as the returning injured get their conditioning back.

Joe,
That could very well be the senario for next season if the game gets scheduled just change DJ and plug it a yet unknown star roaming around the fields of AMAT.
just sayin, watch out because here come those phantom pass interference references. Yes where is the Guru. I for one would like to read his take on the upcoming DR game and last weeks game also.

MORE HIGHLIGHTS/INTERVIEWS!!!

St. Bonaventure vs. Long Beach Poly 2009

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=licwdX1zidY&NR=1

This one's for Fred:

St. Bonaventure @ Long Beach Poly 2009 (Final Score SB 27, LBP 7)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoE_o_xvaPY

Here's another one:

St. Bonaventure @ St. John Bosco 2009 (Final SB 34, SJB 10)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QU8lkWa5tWc&feature=related

No way CO beats BA this year...I would be more open to the idea if CO had beat Rancho Cucamonga but they did not. Regardless, RC is no St. Bonnies.

I know Fred, BTW thanks for the block.

Fred just might be smarter than some of you Amat bloggers. Stir the pot!

49 hits and counting! LMAO

FJR,

Thanks for trying to give some reasons to back up your opinion. Fair enough. Although when you point out the "game of inches" the difference is one team won those inches on that night... and the other didn't. And I think that's where the game is won or lost.

You said you like the CO defense vs Amat offense... I happen to like the reverse... Amat's defense vs CO's offense. Remember - that's a defense that shut out Bonaventure for the 2nd half of regulation and that was a Bonnie team that put up 40+ vs Crespi and dominated a very athletic (albiet young) LB Poly defense. Did you happen to watch that one on FoxSports. Bonnies looked unbeatable... and may be 9 out of 10 times. But not last Friday and that's all that matters. So "could" CO knock of Amat in a similar upset? Sure. I've said many times anyone on our schedule could beat us. That's the way your supposed to schedule. If they couldn't... why play?

Well. I guess, you'd just have to get an answer from a school that schedules differently for that answer.

So in a McConnell-esque fantasy scenario the Amat defense gives young, Santiago fits all night long. The Amat line dominates both sides of the ball and there are no running lanes for Muema and company forcing little Santiago to try to win with his legs and arm. CO is surprised to not have the speed advantage that they have against their normal schedule so receivers are not as open as usual. In a Romo-like performance Santiago's forced into numerous turnovers and Amat wins the takeaway battle once again. Much to everyone's dismay, Thropay remains on the sidelines only to wonder "What if...?"

CO's refusal to kick to Darien Johnson gives Amat good field position all night long and Jay Anderson has a big game behind the Amat line with Shay breaking some big runs as the Chargers try to key on Anderson. Amat finally pulls out the razzle-dazzle with a Ruiz to Johnson pass off a double-reverse and Amat seals the deal with a fade to big tight end Wallace Gonzalez over the undersized CO defensive backs. After the game Charter Oak legend Lou Farrar retires and CO Principal (Amat Alum and former VP) and AD Glen Martinez (former Amat baseball coach)throwing all nepotism guidelines aside and hires Tommy Salter (former Amat football coach) to head the football program so that they can someday "Be Like Lancers"

(Hey I said it was as much a fantasy as McConnell's all-time playoffs. It had to have just as outrageous an ending!)

FRED,

I asked you for the last Pac-5 or equivalent powerhouse and you give me Los Altos and South Hills! LOL!

OK! Allow me rephrase the question,

Has Lou Farrar ever faced the following?

Esperanza
Edison
Carson
Corona Centennial
Redlands East Valley
Mater Dei
Orange Lutheran
St. John Bosco
Servite
St. Paul
Los Alamitos
Long Beach Poly
Valencia
Lakewood
SO Notre Dame
Crespi
Loyola
Alemany
Tesoro
Mission Viejo
Hart
Norco
St. Bonaventure
Oaks Christian
Santa Margarita
Newport Harbor

I do not believe Lou Farrar has faced any of the above mentioned programs...

Or has he?

Bleeds Blue, you know I like all the Amat folks...

Hum.....

Jcaz, I wouldn't bet the mortgate on Bishop Amat either....

Fred,
Are you making up for Guru because he didn't write his analysis this week?

Chargersfan - BTW the Amat/DR score was 17-SIX and Amat took a knee three times on 1st and goal inside the 10 with a 1:45 to go. If they didn't have as much class as they do and respect for Roddy, what if they punch that in and the score is 24-6? How do you compare that to DR's regular season loss to CO at 23-7? Take a look at the stats. Outside of 1 drive DR had 40some yards TOTAL offense vs Amat. Amat dominated the Panthers by as much as the Chargers - since you're comparing. And interesting that you think Amat is "worse" with a returning QB and upgrades at the RB & reciever spots, and a defense that's performing better, while CO loses Allen, still has questions at QB loses their bookend bigs and they're somehow as good? curious for sure.

I've seen a Bishop Amat game, the same one you were at Fred. It's a completely different type of experience than a Southeast/Miramonte game, I mean they have their own In-N-Out truck. I haven't seen CO this year, but I'll see them next week when Bonita plays them. CO has been the class of the Division for four years now, however they haven't played a big time schedule. We play good football out her regardless of whether it is the PAC-5 or not.

Someone said the type of Athlete Amat attracts is the type of athlete that wants to test himself against the best. I wouldn't say that, because if it were so the athlete population of Bishop Amat would be much more diverse and I don't think they would have had the hard years that they had in the not so distant past. However if they continue on the path they are on then Bishop Amat will have all of that and they'll be back, and they'll stay there as well.

I know you've been to CO's games, the only game they didn't have issues was against University. And as someone stated here, Bishop Amat will win their games, but they aren't going to blow people out because that's not how they play.

And my morality gauge says South Hills should not be ranked in any poll. What happened against Northview was despicable at best.

Chargerfan - ARE YOU HIGH! I'm a CO fan and there is NO WAY this team is just as good as last year minus Chris Allen! Root for the home team but remain credible my friend. We are good but not as good as last year and niether is amat!

Blue ,
Let me make myself perfectly clear on this Mgsr. could never ever ever ever ever come close to Msgr. Kiefer because he made AMAT what it is today and if he ever tried to do that all hell would break loose. It was bad enough he over stepped the legend Tate Duff by putting his stamp on Student Activity Center. Thanks Fred for clearing that up. The only point is when that turn around happened in the CO vs RC game you could see the air come out of CO's sails to the tune of here they come and we can't do a thing about it. You got to believe you beat the opponent no matter what, not see them make a play and start to doubt yourselves much like what I saw in our team during the past coach's tenure.. No knock on CO because they do have a fine team , just my opinion.

Guess you you have something to thing about in this..with our best player blah blah blah...it comes down to coaching

THE MORRISON ERA 2-2-1

04 DHS 7 CO 27
05 DHS 26 CO 0
06 DHS 25 CO 9
07 DHS 14 CO 14
08 DHS 21 CO 42

THE GANO ERA

09 DHS 20 CO 23

bishop we get it, but if you like comparing scores, then how come Charter Oak beat Diamond Ranch both times (23-7 and 30-14 in the championship) more impressive than you beat Diamond Ranch at home, 17-9. Even Roddy Layton said last year Charter Oak was a better team. This year's Bishop team isn't as good as last year, and Charter Oak is just as good minus Chris Allen, so yes, Charter Oak would have a very good chance of winning.

Big Lou wants no part of Amat. He learned his lesson a few years ago, or should have. This reminds me of the late 80's when Los Altos was winning. They played Amat and got their heads handed to them twice. Let's stop the "what ifs" and schedule up Lou !!

if you think amat will lose to charter choke you must be the guru or be in his dilapated and mutated gene pool.

lets play lil tyke top ten for a second

charter choke is 4-1
amat is 4-0

charter choke beat damien 23 - 20
amat beat damien 29 - 20

charter choke lost to Rancho Cucamonga

On Oct 6th fred stated and i quote

" 1.Bishop Amat (4-0) - The Lancers are 11-4 in the Hagerty-era, and with a win over Diamond Ranch on Saturday, would become a perfect 6-0 against area teams in his two-year tenure.
2. Charter Oak (4-1) - The expectations were so high, even a close win over Damien felt somewhat disappointing. It doesn't get any easier with Etiwanda in town next, but it's another game that should net a W "

Freddy also stated on Sep. 29
" Tribune Top Ten
1. Bishop Amat (3-0) - With St. Bonaventure next, the stay at the top could be brief. But lets be honest, this is where the Lancers belong. Are they really better than Charter Oak? That's still up for debate.
2. Charter Oak (3-1) - It's a good thing Friday's loss to Rancho Cucamonga wasn't for a championship, because the Chargers would have been sick to their stomach for giving up the momentum-swinging plays. The true measure is how they bounce back at home against Damien."

Another point Fred made Oct. 5
" Southeast Division
1. Rowland, 2. Walnut, 3. Charter Oak, 4. South Hills, 5. El Rancho, 6. Burbank, 7. Santa Fe, 8. Bell Gardens, 9. Crescenta Valley, 10. Alhambra"

Rowland and walnut should beat amat then too..RIGHT FREDD FLINSTONE??

" i do drugs, i used to but i still do"
Mitch Hedburg

makes as much sense as that deceased comedian

i have no clue how you can make these rankings contradicting your own self only days before haha

i think we should have Space Ghost host the prep sports for the trib. at least he'll be a cartoon and ridiculous

Umm, Los Altos, South Hills, El Dorado, look at the resumes throughout the years, they are all perennial powers. Los Altos' teams with Cody, Harwell and Aguilar would have stacked up with Bishop Amat teams in the early part of the decade, so would some of South Hills' teams.

First of all, there is always a football game on Thursday. It just doesn’t happened to always be a varsity game that’s all. Perhaps some of you folks ought to consider attending some of those JV and freshmen games that these school put out there. They are just as much fun and at the same time you get to see the future stars of tomorrow playing today.

BTW, I really have given up on this topic with you Fred. I mean, you can only beat a dead horse so much and to tell you the truth, I though that this horse was already so far dead, that it was already well on it’s way to being dog food.

But, because were talking opinion here (and you know what they say about opinions and azz holes, right ?), I guess that I’ll have a little bit of fun myself with this too.

Look people, I will once again throw this out for all of you out there to think about. If you were a betting man Fred, would you really bet the mortgage to you’re home on a Charter Oak win against Amt either last year or this ?

Really !

I mean think about that question seriously for a moment will you. Hum…..well, I guess that I already know the answer to that question and the answer is probably an absolute no!! And do you know why I know that Fred ? It’s because in the end, you really don’t believe that.

Look, it’s one thing to simply love the hell out of you’re team and to truly believe that they can pull of a big win and defeat a team like Orange Lutheran, but it’s quite another to put you’re money where you’re mouth is.

Tell you what, just to prove my point, maybe what we can do next year is to have all the Amat Honks and all the Charter Oak honks throw in some money on that game. We can donate all the proceeds to charity or even to a banquet for the team that wins the game at the end of the year. Or better yet, who is to say that the kids can’t play an exhibition game sponsored by the tribune at the end of this year, with all the proceeds going to the same thing or even to some worthy cause. I for one would much rather see that, than an all star game at Basset every year.

What do you say ? The gauntlet has been thrown out there for you Charter Oakes people, let do it.

What about coaching???

Lou Farrar also has absolutely no experience playing anyone of value from the Pac-5 or equivalent...besides Bishop Amat that is. Of course, I could be wrong...

HEY FRED!!

BESIDES BISHOP AMAT, who is the last perennial powerhouse that Lou Farrar has faced? And no, Rancho Cucamonga does not even come close! hahahaaa!

Fred your a crock! Go back to the Pasadena Star

Fred:

It's got to be about winning and losing so some degree. It's about setting high goals. Nobody sets goals to be 2nd place, if they did, they would never amount to much. So I think wins and loses must be a part of it. I also think competition is a part of it.

Amat 73, I'm basing it solely on this years teams, not the history, I'm very aware of what Bishop Amat has done to Charter Oak in years past, and very aware that historically speaking, there are no teams in the Valley that can match the competition that Amat players face year in and year out, and how well they have done against that competition. I always have said Bishop Amat is the most important team in the Valley because they can put the Valley on the map like no other team can. I gave my reasons in an earlier comment why I think Charter Oak would win this year, so you can scroll down and read it. As far as South Hills, they would be No. 3 if Jordan and Jamie Canada were eligible, without them, I like both West Covina and Damien in a head-to-head against the Huskies.

Amat 73 - YOU BITE YOUR TONGUE MISTER! If msgr sees that in writing he will try think it's a great idea and try to get the football stadium in his name too! It's bad enough that they named the gym the mac sac.

I will be rooting for Pomona Hills to take down Puente amat on Saturday nite homes. This is our superbowl ese. sabes que gueys? If we can put it on those vatos from puente then pomona hills 0-4 record dont mean nada homes. Member when pomona hills was in the championship? Member? You member ese, Charly homes, Pomona hills aint won caca ese! Superbowl! Superbowl! Superbowl!

Fred J,
You are right in that everyone is entitled to their opinion.I just wonder if you took into account previous head to head games between AMAT and CO and also games against like competition. Also are you just using this year or previous years. Just a question and not knocking nor crying about your rankings as I said you are entitled to your opinion . If it is just a gut feeling with you I understand but if you base it on facts and stats I truely do not understand .Another point is why is SH so low even under Damien ??? In the long run this will have no effect on us and in the future we will try to change your mind by what we do on the field . Or maybe this is just to get the game on the schedule for the next 2 years. I could see MSAC stadium being sold out for those games.

FredJ,

Here's an idea for a new topic.

How about a discussion on who are the best programs / coaches in the valley. Let's not make it just about winning and losing. Let's take into consideration how the coaches relate to the players, how many kids go on to play college ball, who has the best tradition, etc.

What do you think?

All I know is that if Bishop Amat doesn't win on Saturday, what will you say to Fred then? It's not a gimmie and Bishop Amat knows it. I think what Fred is doing is giving Amat the respect it deserves for beating St. Bonny, but also telling us they're not the monster all the Amat honks want us to believe they're.

Unreal, what I write in the Super 31 is not just an opinion, teams earn those rankings. Whether or not I think Charter Oak would defeat Bishop Amat in a head to head game doesn't matter, Bishop Amat deserves to be ranked No. 1 based on what they have done this season, and beating St.Bonaventure last week makes it a no-brainer. Walnut and Rowland are undefeated and deserve to be ahead of West Covina and South Hills in our polls because the Bulldogs and Huskies both have lost two or more, but that doesn't mean I'm not picking West Covina and South Hills each time they match up against them.

Fred, You need Amat #1. After what they just did.. They just put the SG Valley on the Map. I think Rowland may surprise people but that will be settled in league. They might be a legit #2 or #3. Walnut SD would be a great game.

You're entitled to your opinion, Fred. The paper pays you for your reporting and your opinion. I would just like some consistency. At least the BCS consistently overrates (So we think) teams from the major BCS conferences (I.E. SEC, Big10, Big12). We can count on that every year. You want to have your cake and eat it too, I get it.

Its unfair to fans and their teams to have one post where you say Amat is #1 and then another saying the team right behind them will beat them.

I dont want to come off as bashing you. I really enjoy 95% of the stuff you write. I just think this was a terrible idea. Rankings are supposed to be based on your opinion being the writer who is immersed in SGV football. If you truly feel CO is better than Amat show it in the Super 31.

Go Amat!!!

LMAO... "What a maroon!"... I hope someone gets the reference.

Everybody is entitled to there own opinion, but each and every time Amat has played your favorite team (CO Chargers) they have destroyed them. Amat steps up to anyone in that wants to play them. (OLU, St Bonnies..etc) Amat has played CO while Amat was "supposedly down" and Charter Oak was "supposedly at their Best." Look what happened.. CO was outclassed by speed, conditioning, and mental toughness. I give props to Big Lou and his success/accomplishments throughout his tenure, but difference is highly distinguishable. And I hate to tell you, but it was Big Lou who does not want to play Amat. Why? In fear of loosing some of the athletes he has to Amat. Fred it your opinion and you are entitled to it as is everyone else. I sit here quiet and listening to you and the rest of the Amat neigh sayers saying: "if Darian didn't run this back... and Darian didnt run that back... and Amat got lucky... and so on and so forth.." Its all part of the game my friend! plain and simple. A win is a win end of story. Call me an Amat "Honk" if you will, but history has proven you neigh sayers wrong time and time again. Amat still has a long way to go to get back to national prominence, but Hagerty has them off to a good start. The toughest game left for Amat in pre-season is Alemany, but I have a hunch we will be 7-0 going into league with the possibility of going 9-1 (loss to Notre Dame) but who knows anything can happen. Hagerty got rid of the Bye week for a reason and that is to keep momentum going and maintain an edge. Week by week Amat has gotten better and better and took a huge step last week. This is a very young Amat team, and is being very well coached.

I just want to say good luck to all the SGV teams playing tomorrow night..

That would be huge for DR and their 0-4 or is it 1-4 program? That would be like bishop amats win over st bonnie! Anything can happen once the players take the field!

Good job fred you finally got it right. Bishop Amat is good but charter oak will beat them. Bishop Amat is not the best team in SGV and will probably not even make playoffs again..Fred keep up the great work here....

It's okay Fred, we get it. I know this is just for fun, but it's also a feeble attempt at appeasing the anti Amat group who thinks you are on Amat's payroll. But get real, if Amat had to prepare a game against CO, it would be a good close one, but the unbiased majority would still have their money on the Lancers. CO choked against Rancho, almost lost to a 1-9 doormat City team and we beat a Nationally Ranked team, it's a no brainer.

wow wouldnt it be something if dr beat amat...what an upset...under the lights anything could happened....

I can't believe there are no comments on that video, that was freakin hilarious...

Fred - And hopefully you also know that all comments are in fun? I really don't believe that man for man, CO is better than Amat. And here I go sounding high and mighty again and I knoe this will bring down the Amat Hater crowd BUT Amat just gets a different type of athlete at their school. I truly believe that Amats second team could start at the local H.S. not that they are without talented athletes because there are many very talented athletes at the local schools. The athlete that goes to Amat goes there to test their athletic skills and to compete against the best and to see where they match up against the best kids around. I don't think I can explain it more eloquently, maybe a former Amat athlete can help me out. I believe that Amat takes the game with CO based on man to man athletic skill, athletic desire and over all athletic talent. Go Big Blue!

Just to be fair, I set up a mythical game between Bishop Amat and Charter Oak on CalPreps to view what their projection would be ... They obviously don't agree with me...And BTW, why do some of you get so personal and beat up over all of this, it's just for fun, why can't we all agree that we disagree and leave it at that...As far as my logic Joe, I just explained it below..
CalPreps projection: Bishop Amat 31, Charter Oak 10

Hilarious! Freddie I luv ya and all but ... seriously? No reason to "hammer" you, everyone is entitled to their own opinion - regardless of how wrong it might be !:?)
Next post maybe list some reasons why you "believe" what you do. Then it becomes more than just a "feeling". Vegas thrives because bettors have "feelings".

All of a sudden Bishop should be the best cuz they beat St. Bonnies? WC took it to Bishop until the end, now WC could've probably takin out St. Bonnies too? Bishop is not that good, you all have to realize that. They beat St. Bonnies, but until they prove to beat good teams week after week Bishop is still not a top PAC-5 team. I would also take CO over Bishop. It would be a close one though, a fight til the end. That was Bishops only good win so far, if they were as good as everyone wants to believe their games with Damien and WC wouldn't have been so close. Dominguez doesn't have the greatest team either, a less than 500 record this year and last year. Don't get me wrong Bishop is a good team, but CO has a better team position by position. That's probably where Fred's logic comes from..........

Look, Washington beat USC, that doesn't mean Washington is better than USC just because they beat them does it? I like Charter Oaks defense against Bishop Amat's offense, I think they could hold them to 14 points or less while the Chargers' offense scores enough to pull it out. I know Charter Oak lost to Rancho, but I also know Charter Oak dominated the entire first half and if not for the 10-point blocked field goal switch at the end of the first half that changed all the momentum, the Chargers would have beaten them that night. It's a game of inches, right? In my opinion that one play changed the whole landscape of the game from an emotional standpoint. Against St. Bonny's, Amat was about to go down 24-10 when Darien made the game-chaning 84-yard INT return to tie the score, 17-17. It's a game of inches, right? They missed an extra point, the Lancers made theirs. That's why I don't base my opinion just on the final outcomes of the games, because the previous games have no bearing on what would happen if they met on a neutral field.

That's OK Fred, you also took St. Bonnie's AND damien too, right? When you toss that coin for your weekly picks, do you catch the coin in the air or let it hit the ground? Go Big Blue!!!

Fred are you saying CO could compete with St. Bonnie's? How about last year could CO have played LB POLY the what Amat did?

FRed maybe Guru is rubbing off on you...that makes marginal sense at best....saying CO is still better the week after AMAT BEATS ST. BONNIE IS JUST STUPID...sorry Fred but that does qualify as just plain stupid.

Any other week and I wouldn't come off so harsh as I've always been a fan.

Isn't Bise State proving something after beating Oklahoma a few years back...sooner or later you hav eto get it done on teh field and CO as I said before has been the underdog once in 2 years...that's not challenging yourself especially when RC was a toss up and they lost after a good 1st half.

The rest of this year is CO a "tossup" even in any other game thru the Championship? Still wondering what evidence you have other than a "feeling".

your going to tell me that west co is better than damien???? They were 1 or 2 plays to beating amat and they would've beat co if it wasnt for 2 bad pat snaps

It amazes me how you just don't get it. Yes, Amat deserves the top ranking, they're undefeated and have defeated more impressive opponents. But if Amat and Charter Oak played on a neutral field tomorrow, I would take the Chargers to beat them, that's all this is about. Don't take it personal, don't get to crazy, it's just an opinion.

Fred i thought you were smarter then that... figure it out......its not that hard ...dont be stupid...what games are you watching?????

Fred i thought you were smarter then that... figure it out......its not that hard ...dont be stupid...what games are you watching?????

This is a terrible topic. If you really think Charter Oak is better than Amat do it in your ranking. This seems like an easy way out of making a bad call on the Super 31 or whatever you want to call it.

Lets face it... Amat is the best team in the SGV. Their record proves it. Charter Oak's run-first offense would not stand a chance against Amats stingy defense. Then you have to rely on a sophomore QB (Kid has huge potential though and should have a successful HS career) to win a game for you. Just saying....

Fred, Thanks for the "Just Tribbin" post on your rankings. Your are right, it is a balancing act. Kind of like the BCS vs Coaches poll, but that is what makes it fun. The blog wouldn't be any fun if we all agreed all the time. Most of the time by the time we get about halfway through league play, all the who's better than who takes care of itself. So you can be the BCS and the rest of us will be the coaches poll.

SGV Ouuut!