The Scouting Guru’s Grand Plan for the Hacienda

League re-alignments won’t happen until 2014, but the Scouting Guru is already looking ahead.

Guru’s Thoughts: So I’m messing with the thought of making the Hacienda League a “Super League” and spliting it into two divisions for football with week 10 being championship “crossover” week. This is what they are doing in the Marmonte League this year with a bunch of eyes watching closely.

Here is my initial thought on how you would break up the league

North
Diamond Bar
Diamond Ranch
Los Altos
Rowland
Walnut

South
Bonita
Charter Oak
Glendora
South Hills
West Covina

So in week 10, you would have North 1 vs South 1 and the winner of that game would be the top-seed from the league and the loser would be the second place team. North 2 vs South 2 would determine the third and fourth place teams. North 3 vs South 3 would be interesting in that the winner might have an inside track to getting an “at-large” birth for the playoffs.

As you can see, geography was in play. The school in the north are basically schools on the 60 freeway. The teams in the south are school along the 10/57 freeway. And you are still preserving the rivalries in the area. Walnut vs Diamond Bar, South Hills vs West Covina, Charter Oak vs Glendora, Diamond Bar vs Diamond Ranch.

Tell me if I’m on the right track. — JE

Facebook Twitter Plusone Digg Reddit Stumbleupon Tumblr Email
  • Fred Robledo

    My only problem with James’ proposal is the five best teams are in the South. It makes sense from a geographical standpoint, but for football it makes for a lopsided championship game. I would switch Diamond Bar and Diamond Ranch with West Covina and South Hills…Now you’re talking…

    North
    West Covina
    South Hills
    Los Altos
    Rowland
    Walnut

    South
    Diamond Bar
    Diamond Ranch
    Bonita
    Charter Oak
    Glendora

  • Joe Amat

    I this alignment the South is stronger than the North. Even though the schools you have listed now as the North are actually South of those you have listed in the South. But I digress.

    What you’ve proposed is similiar to the plan I’ve proposed over the last couple years. This is old from the last leaguing go’round, but since we’re talking lets have at it. Some might have changed in two years – but you’ll get the idea.

    People have come on here and commented that Amat gets to be in different leagues for other sports – yet is in the Serra for football. In the other sports we are in the Camino Del Rey Association that has 12 teams. Every two years – in every sport – if a team in the Del Rey has finished in last place it moves down to the Camino Real and the first place team in the Camino Real moves up. The same situation exists in “Gold Coast Athletic Conference” has 17 teams and 3 leagues. South Bay Athletic Association has 18 teams and 3 leagues, the Western Athletic Conference has 14 teams and 2 leagues, while the Tri-County Athletic Association has 13 teams and two leagues

    If they were to create 2 of these “mega-conferences” in the Inland Empire and the SGV it could go something like the groups below. You maintain some semblance of geography and maybe St Lucy’s is the one who gets hit the hardest from a travel perspective – but they’re paired with Damien so it’s tough to battle. You could move schools around however you like to start – because champions and cellar dwellers could move up and down from A,B,C or 1,2,3,4 and it would continue to self-correct in each individual sport.

    *Inland Empire Athletic Association*
    A. Baseline League: Alta Loma, Etiwanda, Los Osos, Rancho Cucamonga, Upland
    B. Sierra League: Ayala, Chino Hills, Claremont, Damien/St. Lucy’s, Colony
    (A & B can “cross-league 1 week to fill in the bye)
    C. Mt. Baldy League: Chaffey, Chino, Don Lugo, Garey, Montclair, Ontario

    *San Gabriel Valley Athletic Association*
    1. San Antonio: Glendora,Charter Oak,South Hills,West Covina,Diamond Ranch,Diamond Bar
    2. Hacienda League: Bonita, San Dimas, Los Altos, Wilson, Rowland, Walnut
    3. Valle Vista League: Baldwin Park, Covina, Nogales, Northview, Pomona, Azusa
    4. Montview League: Bassett, Duarte, Ganesha, Gladstone, La Puente, Sierra Vista, Workman

  • Aaron

    This makes no geographical sense unless you just screwed up in your labeling…how could Bonita, Glendora, CO be in the South? Literally impossible.

  • Almost

    Guru
    Joe Amat is right, your geography is upside down.

    Fred
    You are right, Guru has too much power on the South bracket and not enough on the North bracket. Your brackets are better but Walnut Unified would insist on Walnut and Diamond Bar being in the same bracket to preserve the rivalry. I would say flip Diamond Bar and Rowland in your brackets. Over the course of 5 or 6 years this league would be dominated by Charter Oak and Glendora in the South Bracket and Westco in the North bracket.

  • ConcuSSionSymptomS

    NONE of these leagues are going to be willing to go to 5 teams. I realize you all want Glendora out of the Baseline, but to remove them, you must replace them… And you cant remove Glendora without also removing Alta Loma… Both schools are going to have to be ready to spend another 3 years in the Baseline.

  • Fred Robledo

    I guarantee Glendora will not be in the Baseline in 2014. They were screwed by the decision makers. They’re a public school traveling like a private school. What the principals and ADs did by placing them in a league where the closest league team is Los Osos was unforgivable considering the high costs of travel and the budgets that schools face today. ADs and principals were supposed to weigh geographic proximity equally with competitive equity. Will someone please explain how that was weighed equally?

  • ConcuSSionSymptomS

    So who replaces them sir? Because the Baseline is NOT going to go to a 5 team league. And once again, what is done with an Alta Lome school that competes in nothing but wrestling in a Baseline League that they have been in for far longer than Glendora. You might be right, I just think what you think they did to Glendora, they will have to do someone else. And Glendora doesn’t want out just because of travel, it is because of competition level as well.

    And I think that Upland is much closer to Glendora than Los Osos?!?!

    Dont get me wrong, I am all for both schools being replaced in a league that neither belong, but once again, replaced by whom?

  • Bulldogs have bite

    Everybody is right. The geography is reversed. And your south division is way over powered. The last place team in your south division would roll the north. And that’s not bashing the teams in the north. DB, DR and LA are all capable of fielding great teams. But man, CO, WC, SHills, Glendora and Bonita would be a solid Central Division league!

  • Fred Robledo

    Chino Hills or Ayala would be much better candidates than Glendora. Chino Hills especially, makes more sense geographically, from a competitive standpoint in all sports, and enrollment, the three factors you are supposed to use.

  • ConcuSSionSymptomS

    I am in agreement with Chino Hills sir maybe even Damien to replace Glendora. I can also see Colony replacing Alta Loma.

    The realignment is going to be interesting next year. I just have a feeling that both teams are going to get screwed!

  • where?

    Where will Edgewood high school be placed in all this?

  • http://www.insidesocal.com/sgvfootball Aram

    I agree with Aaron, the labeling of the divisions is either an oversight or complete incompetence. The teams in the North are actually from the South and vice versa.

    Anyway, it’s cute idea that would create some epic games, but it has no chance.

    Fred, the five best teams are not in the South (North?) when you consider that West Covina is in the North (South?) and is probably the No. 1 or 2 overall team between two the leagues.

  • Fred Robledo

    Stop teasing, I heard Edgewood may never have a football team, that breaks my heart. I talked to its principal a few months back and asked if they could start with an eight-man team, something, anything.

  • Almost

    1. Glendora will definitely be coming out of the Baseline on the next go round. They were kicking and screaming to not go into that league in the first place.
    2. The Baseline is right there in Alta Loma’s back yard so it’s going to be more difficult for them to get out of that league then it will be for Glendora.
    3. If Alta Loma and Glendora come out, why does everyone assume that the baseline has to look West? I would think the best bet for Alta Loma to come out would be to flip spots with Cahon, Summit, or AB Miller. Glendora should be switching spots with Claremont but I’m sure Claremont won’t be happy with a return ticket to the Baseline either and Damien is further east then Glendora as well.

  • sgv scouting

    Now this is the type of discussion that I’m willing to get involved with. Couple of points…

    1) Name of the divisions: Hey, it doesn’t have to be the North or South Division. You can name it whatever you want. In the Big 10 Conference, you have the legends and leaders divisions. No big thing at all.

    2) One of the things that I was very aware of was the fact that I wanted to keep the rivalries in play and keep the travel down. I think it’s very important for Diamond Bar to play Walnut. It’s also very important for South Hills to play West Covina and it’s very important for Charter Oak to play Glendora.

    Now, I like some of the suggestions for swapping a team or two. I think the one that has Rowland and Diamond Bar swapping spots in perfect.

    Also, in this format, you have every a team play five league, four in their own division and a cross-over game from other division. For instance, if you slot Diamond Bar in the same division as South Hills, West Covina, Bonita and Charter Oak, with the extra “crossover” game, they would be able to play Walnut.

    In this situation, Diamond Bar would only have to play four pre-season games.

    Remember week 10 would have (ok we’ll use Aaron and Aram’s geography) North 1 vs South 1. And in the last couple of years, you would probably have had West Covina play Diamond Ranch.

    Plus, one other thing to consider, team momentum goes in cycles. What’s happening now might change in a couple of years. After all, we’d all agree (in the football end of things) that the SEC is a little top heavy right between the East and the West.

    We are trying to find a way to keep the costs down, make things interesting and generate more interest in weeks 8, 9 and 10. Oh, and how about have the Hacienda League Championship game at Citrus College with both teams getting a 50/50 split of the gate.

    Let’s keep the conversation going. This is nice!!!!

  • As I see it

    I like the idea of league changes for some of these schools. But I think the college super conference approach is not necessary. How about ease of travel and rivalries to really make it fun on friday night example: Hacienda – Diamond Ranch, Diamond Bar, Walnut, Rowland, Chino Hills, Ayala, Chino and Don Lugo. Easy travel good competition in all sports not just football. I feel we have to start talking all sports in school not just football when you are looking at these changes. Why would any school off the 210/57 have to come all the way over to the 60. San Antonio – Glendora, Charter Oak, West Covina, Covina, South Hills, Damien, Bonita, San Dimas. Take it from here for the other areas as well. Easy – but it will never happen.

  • Aaron

    You see…I don’t understand what you’re advocating with this Escarcega.

    Are you advocating a division compression in football where you have at least 40 teams in a division? or 50? and have ten teams per league?

    Because it seems a bit hypocritical when we’ve sparred on this when you say that the PAC-5 shouldn’t be expanded with either the addition of teams or leagues.

    Or are you saying the Sierra just stinks and will never compete beyond the second round of the Inland playoffs?

  • sgv scouting

    Here is the deal. When you add teams for a playoff division, you are adding games. As it is right now, if a team wants to win a state championship, they have to play a mind-boggling 16 GAMES with no breaks.

    And here is another thing, in the Pac-5, every playoff game is a knock down drag out affair. And when you are dealing with 16 and 17 years old, to give them more games with your thinking is absurd.

    What we are doing here with the Hacienda League is keeping the schedule at 10 games, fan friendly from a geography point of view, maintaining the rivalaries that are important to the area, and have a league championship night in week 10 where the fans, the school and the players play in a fantastic atmosphere with the schools’s getting a nice little payday from a great gate.

    And what is wrong with that?

    You have no idea what it’s like the Pac-5 and as Jim Mora would say, “You have no idea, and you will never know.”

    This is what happens when you escape the bubble that is the San Gabriel Valley and look at the broader picture of football in Southern California.

  • Pure Incompetence

    So when some one else says this is complete incompetence that holds water but when other people question Jaime’s competence it’s not?

    Hopefully this proves Jaime is not what he pretends to be. Yes he’s coached for over 20 years but then again so has Karl Dorrell and he flat out sucked !

    The whole concept of dropping Charter Oak and not moving WC up to, and down from, the Sierra League is pure lunacy. WC should move up to the Sierra.

    What’s comical is when Jaime or any one else who writes for a living shows their incompetence it’s labeled as, just shaking the trees, as if they could do the same thing with reasoned positions.

  • Aaron

    Mr. Escarcega,

    Yeah, that’s a negative.

  • AMAT 73

    Guru,
    Why pull CO and SH out of D-2 and the Sierra. For the simple reason of fan friendlier games and nice gates. You give no logical reason what so ever as to why pull the defending champ from their league and division. Maybe create a better fan friendlier locally based Sierra with Damien ( or Bonita,CH,Glendora take your pick ) , WC , SH , CO , and Monrovia of which travel will not be a burden to any of these teams and put them all in D-2 which I think the SGV fans would like better as they would move on in the playoffs and play teams outside of the SGV. WC and Monrovia seem to be the teams with all the juice right now as Aram would say and should fit well with the others. What’s interesting is your point on the PAC-5 being tough in the playoffs and using that for your you have no idea quote from Mora (who more often fell on his face in the NFL and now toiling at UCLA ) on life outside the fishbowl . Well aren’t you adding to this fishbowl way of life by having some of the top teams Iin the SGV just battle it out amongest themselves for a title with disreagard for life outside the bowl ? The object is to improve and move up make the other areas ( OC,IE, ) take note of SGV football by these teams making a mark in higher divisions instead fo just banging heads with each other or do you advocate keeping the fishbowl in check by this super league ? I for one would like to see our teams make deeper runs in D-2 instead of bowing out as you profess . And the deeper runs goes for AMAT in the PAC-5 also not just the teams I’ve listed, to be fair .

  • Dogtown

    Amat 73 Well said!