BLOG exclusive: Charter Oak, South Hills, Glendora, Baldwin Park, Pomona, Garey, and Alta Loma ask for relief at Mt. SAC area meeting

Mt. SAC area league representatives met today to discuss league placement/realignment for the 2014-16 cycle, which begins in the 2014-15 season. Before new leagues can be created or reconfigured, schools were given a chance to ask for relief, with seven area schools in the Mt. SAC area asking for relief in advance of May 13, which is the day the Mt. SAC area must finalize league configurations for the 2014-15 season. According to multiple sources at the meeting today, Charter Oak and South Hills asked for relief from the Sierra League. Pomona and Baldwin Park asked for relief from the Valle Vista League. Glendora and Alta Loma asked for relief from the Baseline League and Garey asked for relief from the Mt. Baldy League. Damien and St. Lucy’s are no longer part of the Mt. SAC area after losing an appeal with the CIF-SS on Tuesday to remain in the Sierra League. Damien and St. Lucy’s will be placed in Parochial leagues for the 2014-15 season and beyond. Also, one of the big decisions decided today is that beginning in the 2014-15 season, the Mt. SAC area will re-league every two years instead of the current structure, which is every four years.

Fred’s thoughts: Now that schools have asked for relief, the big question is, will they get it, and where will they go? Charter Oak, South Hills and Glendora almost certainly will get relief, but where? Could a super 10-team, north-south Hacienda League be created? Possible. Pomona and Baldwin Park would like to drop to the Montview League. Edgewood High School, back in business since closing its doors in 1988 is back in the mix and will likely be placed in the Montview League. Could the Montview become a 10-team league of the north-south variety as well? Possible. And who joins the Valle Vista if Baldwin Park and Pomona leave? These are all things that have to be decided by May 13. Your thoughts?

Here is my proposal
Hacienda League North or Sierra League

Bonita, Glendora, South Hills, Charter Oak, West Covina
Hacienda league South
Los Altos, Rowland, Diamond Ranch, Diamond Bar, Walnut
Montview League North
Sierra Vista, Azusa, Pomona, Duarte, Ganesha
Montview League South
Workman, La Puente, Edgewood, Bassett, Gladstone
Valle Vista League
Covina, Northview, Wilson, Baldwin Park, San Dimas, Garey
Baseline League
Etiwanda, Los Osos, Rancho Cucamonga, Etiwanda, Chino Hills, Ayala
Mt. Baldy League:
Chaffey, Chino, Colony, Don Lugo, Claremont, Montclair, Ontario, Alta Loma

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  • http://twitter.com/cbnboy34 patrick tyrone

    Some of these schools (Need i mention) should be ashamed! They dominate in football , and have the audacity to whine and moan about being in a tough league?? Let me guess, this is about wanting to be place in a league where they can completely humiliate other schools!

  • http://twitter.com/cbnboy34 patrick tyrone

    i would almost certainly deny CO,S.H and Glendora the relief they think they should get, if anything i would move them into another playoff division, but for league purposes , they need to stay right where they are!

  • 238

    Fred, Re-leagueing is big picture, not small. You give homes to 25 teams, but not the other 15/16. The Sierra gets gutted in your proposal. What happens to them? It is my understanding that leagues don’t want to be 5 team leagues (only 2 auto-bids). Why are Charter Oak, South Hills, and Glendora almost certainly getting relief? If anyone gets relief in the Baseline it should be Alta Loma, since they are only competitive in 1 sport most of the time. Garey is also a prime candidate for relief, more so than the other schools you mentioned. Yet those are the only two schools that asked for relief that did not show up in you re-league ideas. I do agree that there will be at least one new league created, but have no idea who may end up in it. It depends on which teams put together voting coalitions.

    • Ray_Morehart

      I will have more on the “coalitions” soon…

  • GP AKA Green Machine

    It’s strange because in Order for Charter Oak, South Hills, and Glendora to get relief, they would have to be moved back into the the Southeast in Football. Actually that is where they belong. I know, I know, all of the SGV bloggers think by putting CO back into that Division or Central Division would mean back to back to back titles again. That is not the case. CO success has came mostly from transfers, and out of area players. Which made CIF think that CO was ready for the inland, but that was not the case. The underlying secret(if you want to call it that), was CO did not have sustainable inland level talent year after year. Neither did the other teams in that league except for CH. After, having terrible losses in the Inland playoffs the transferring seems to be slowing down. Also, it’s one thing to be above all the other SGV teams in weeks 1-5, but the playoffs are totally different for everyone one. Especially, with injuries, grades and 30 day sit out tranfers becoming eligible. It’s about time CIF does make some changes, there a few schools who should be moved up or down.

    1. Blair-Should consider shutting down Football and Baseball programs.
    2. Bishop Amat- Doesn’t play D-1 in any other sport, be they want to continue in Pac 5…so be it…
    3.Charter Oak- Does not need to be in inland…Central or Southeast…take your pick.
    4. Monrovia-17-2 in last 5 years Should not be in Midvalley, should be in Pacific and Southeast Division. It’s time to experience the threat of losing in 1st of 2nd Round.
    5. Damien- Does not belong in the Inland. Would be good fit for Western Division.

    • Ray_Morehart

      San Dimas dominates that league in every sport. They need to be moved as well.

      • Colt74

        Really? Since 2001 who has won more games in football against each other ( hint..it starts with a COVINA ), How has San Dimas done against Covina in basketball the last few years, Baseball? Dominates in every sport? Not even close! Maybe you were talking about synchronized swimming..since we don’t have a team…

    • Not Since 1995

      GP AKA Cracker
      Looks like Charter Oak, South Hills, and Glendora will continue to COMPETE while the “MILDcats” get smoked by teams like Arcardia and Rosemead, and still get a Cracker Jack ring at the end of the season…!

      What kind of pride could you possibly have in representing CIF Division 11.5…? Go ahead and remind of how many schollys you had last year. Don’t forget the recent 3 Cracker Jack rings too…! But remember, the fact is that if and when you play South Hills or Charter Oak or a Glendora you and your “Local Talent” will go home back to Monrovia carrying your A$$ in your 2 hands…! That is a FACT…!
      Go ahead and go the Southeast…! I’m willing to bet your mother’s nuts that you won’t even make playoffs in the Southeast…Boy…! Inland Division is laughing your CIF Division 11.5 rights…! So is Western Christian…!
      Not In 2013

      • jcaz

        Where does salesian Frank ? where do they fall in all of this ?

  • Give me a break

    Regardless of what CIF claims, everyone knows that Football drives re-leaguing. With that in mind, how the in the h*ll does CO have the audacity to ask for relief when they have:

    1. Won league 2 of the 1st 3 years that they have been in the Sierra League.
    2. Been to the playoffs each of the last 3 years.
    3. Won a 1st round playoff game each of the last 2 years which (by my math) makes them a perennial top 8 team in the Inland Division.

    South Hills – yes, they deserve relief, probably to the Hacienda.
    Glendora – yes, they deserve relief, probably taking Damien’s spot in the Sierra.
    Alta Loma – yes, they need relief, probably swapping spots with Colony in the Mt. Baldy
    Baldwin Park and Pomona – probably won’t get relief, but MTSAC will probably change some teams around to balance out the power in some of the leagues within the Midvalley Division.
    Gary – even though they play in Division 5, the Mt Baldy is a terrible league which is debatable weather or not it’s as good as the VVL and therefore relief probably would hurt them more then help them.

  • Robert

    I wish the CIF-SS would put some thought into separating the PRIVATE schools from the PUBLIC schools. Seems unfair for any public school to be in the same division as ANY private school. I’m speaking about the Division 4AA.

  • GP AKA Green Machine

    Mt Sac league but in Central Div(5)
    Charter Oak
    West Covina
    South Hills
    Glendora
    Damien
    Colony

    New Baseline league Inland Div (2)
    Upland
    Rancho
    Chino Hills
    Ayala
    Etiwanda
    Los Osos

    New Pacific Southeast Div(7)
    Muir
    PHS
    Arcadia
    Monrovia
    Burbank
    Burroughs
    CV

    New Hacienda league Southeast Div(7)
    Daimond Bar
    Bonita
    Rowland
    Diamond Ranch
    Los Altos
    Walnut

    New Mount Baldy Central Div(5)**Only needs 2 auto bids
    Chino
    Alta Loma
    Ontario
    Chaffey
    Don Lugo
    Montclair

    • Give me a break

      Not bad, but you will have to get rid of Damien because they got the boot from MTSAC and will be in the Catholic Association (where they belong)

      • GP AKA Green Machine

        Right…Well shouldn’t BA go to that league too?

        • Give me a break

          Pretty sure BA is already in the Catholic Association.

          • GP AKA Green Machine

            will that be Pac 5 or what?

          • Give me a break

            Depends on how the Catholic Association decides they want to league their teams. I believe the Mission, Serra, Trinity, Del Rey are all leagues that are under the Catholic Association umbrella – I’m pretty sure there are other leagues under the CA umbrella, but I’m not sure what league those are. Maybe the Alpha, Olympic etc.

          • GP AKA Green Machine

            Wow, none of those teams in the Alpha or Olympic are ready to jump in with the likes of Serra and Trinity teams….They only scored 21 pts total in games against Monrovia in the last two years. This Catholic Assc is bad Idea… They should just have catholic leagues but still make sure they are in the right division.

          • Give me a break

            The Catholic Association is something that has existed for some time now, just like the MTSAC Association. The Associations control/decide how teams in certain areas are leagued and grouped together. In the case of the Catholic Association (which is actually a Private School Association not just for Catholic Schools) Just because a team is in the Catholic Association doesn’t mean that they will be placed in a league with the likes of Trinity teams. Just like the MTSAC Association teams are placed into leagues that they are suppose to be able to compete.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Oso-Viejo/100001718155340 Oso Viejo

      Things I like about GP’s league alignment:

      Monrovia UP to D7

      San Dimas UP to D7

      A new Mt. Sac League? D5? Yeah, OK, that works.

      Some small concerns:

      Not so sure about where you slotted Ayala and I would probably move
      Walnut or Rowland down, maybe into the Valle Vista and readjust the
      Montview. Not a fan of 7 team leagues.

      As pointed out, that Mt. Baldy League is just cruising for a bruising in D5. Yeah, Kaiser and Colton each had a great year, but since the last realignment, how many SB County teams have excelled there. Better to head down to the Eastern Division and spend the fuel money on afternoon bus rides than ambulance rides after 8.

      • Give me a break

        1. Unlikely that they would call any league the Mt. Sac League when the name of the association also goes by the name MTSAC. The Sierra League is a more likely name, especially since it’s one of the oldest league names in the Southern Section.
        2. Unlikely that Rowland would be moved down when just this past year they shared a piece of the Hacienda League Title.

        • http://www.facebook.com/people/Oso-Viejo/100001718155340 Oso Viejo

          My oh my, aren’t you fussy?

          Go on ahead and have it your way, call the new league the Sierra even though the East San Gabriel Valley has about as much to do with the Sierra’s as the San Gabriel Valley League does with the San Gabriel Valley. But you knew that, right?

          You are right about Rowland having a share of this season’s four-way 4-2 finish in the Hacienda . . . pretty exciting, that. FTR, I was mostly looking at the recent history of the Hacienda where the Raiders have gone 5-13 the last three years and managed only a .500 record in football in the previous eight San Antonio seasons, (that even with a couple of Michael Ball fueled runs).

          Walnut would be easier to dump as they had the same 5-13 Hacienda record but recorded only 18 wins in the SA since 2002. Neither has won more than two playoff games this century.

          Walnut DOES have a really good band.

          • AMAT 73

            Oso,

            I believe GMAB is referring to the Sierra league being a very old SGV league . It contained LP , WC , LA , SH , and Edgewood many years ago so he does have some validity to his statement of it being one of the oldest leagues in the CIF-SS. Must not be that old of a bear that you don’t know the history of the Sierra league ????

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Oso-Viejo/100001718155340 Oso Viejo

            73,

            Not only am I an Old Bear, I am older than you. OK, just a year, I was class of ’72. And the Sierra? I know the Sierra. I was just yanking the GMAB chain.

            Kinda surprised you don’t recognize my style.

          • AMAT 73

            Old bear and long time blogger with huge ties to the Sierra with a new screen name perhaps ????? One name comes to mind though .Are you tied into WC ???? I did like the Montview comment concerning the MV . I also see no logic to keeping Ayala at D-2 and CO to D-5 ???? Maybe for the same reason , to make someone feel good in the MV , hint , hint.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Oso-Viejo/100001718155340 Oso Viejo

            Well, you have solved part of the puzzle my friend. No real ties to the old Sierra other than friendly ones. Let’s just say my ties, kind of like those of my pal WC Dan, are to the old Whitmont League.

            Now, to your points . . . The Inland Division belongs to the football schools of Riverside County and the Baseline League. Neither Charter Oak nor Ayala can compete at that level. Not enough kids and too much talent dilution from nearby, (minivan, Amat, wink, wink). The Central Division looks about right and the Mt Baldy League surely needs an infusion of competitive
            talent.

      • GP AKA Green Machine

        I thought about the Mt baldy going to Eastern Div, actually each of those schools would only have one bus ride, because they won’t have 2. As far as the montview that works because they would get 4 spots for sure. If they are good, they could get at at large too. I think CIF should look at some league changes. I think The D7 suburban league may need some changes towards the bottom with Cerritos and Glenn.

        I made changes for Ayala to Chino HIlls, because they are both really big schools and should be in a league with schools of similar size in their area. There is not one school in the Sierra, besides CH and that has sniffed a winning chance in the inland. There is talent in that area, so Ayala, could be good in the future depending on where the talent goes.

        I would not move Walnut or Rowland.
        Rowland had some big wins this year and walnut is just too big to be A MVL Or Northwest school. They just have to get better coaches or work harder.

        • http://www.facebook.com/people/Oso-Viejo/100001718155340 Oso Viejo

          Not to be overly picky but are you sure you want to see the Montview get 4 playoff spots? They’ve only won eight post season games in the last dozen years, all but one of them by either Duarte or Azusa.

          There was a time that I was convinced the Montview only got playoff spots to make the Mid-Valley League feel better about themselves.

          As far as Ayala goes, I all for anything that improves their chances. After Amat picked up that minivan full of kids a couple years ago I think the Valley at large owes them something. ;) Saddling them up in the Baseline may be just too much in the long term. They’d be better off in the new D5 league with C O and friends.

          The Walnut/Rowland problem is, neither is going anywhere in fallsport in a single digit division, to coin a phrase. Both schools have large student bodies but neither seem to have large enough students to field a competitive team in the Southeast. The Section also likes to point at periodic successes in other sports but as I have said in the past, nobody orders up multiple ambulances for a girl’s volleyball contest.

  • Ray_Morehart

    South Hills will most likely get relief from the Sierra
    League. The principals from South Hills, Covina, and Northview have already put
    together a deal that the Covina and Northview principals will vote in favor
    South Hills’ relief. In doing so, Covina and Northview won’t be put into South
    Hills’ league. Why do you ask? They do not want to be put into South Hills’
    league again. Covina and Northview kicked South Hills out of the Valle Vista
    League back in the day because South Hills’ athletic teams were too dominant.
    Why get your teams better when you can just kick the better team out? South
    Hills is only agreeing to this deal because Covina and Northview has agreed to
    play non-league games in all the sports. Some people may ask, “Why would
    they not want to be in the same league but still agree to play non-league
    games?” Here’s the answer: They would rather play only one game against
    South Hills rather than have to suffer through 2 or more games in a setting
    that effects their team’s playoff seeding. This is what is wrong with schools.
    They don’t want to get their team better. It is a sad, sad world when teams
    actually want to get into the Montview League. I could easily see at least one
    10-team super league coming into existence. For example, I could see one of the
    super leagues include: Bonita, Charter Oak, Diamond Bar, Diamond Ranch,
    Glendora, Los Altos, Rowland, South Hills, Walnut, and West Covina. In a sense,
    I would be combining the Sierra [excluding St. Lucy's/Damien (parochial league)
    and the Chino Hills schools (possibly to the Mt. Baldy League with schools such
    as Don Lugo and Chino)] and the Hacienda with the addition of Glendora. The new
    league would have a North and a South division. The North would be composed of
    Bonita, Glendora, Charter Oak, South Hills, and West Covina. The South would be
    Diamond Bar, Diamond Ranch, Rowland, Los Altos, and Walnut. Glendora would be
    getting some relief in the sense that they wouldn’t have to compete with teams
    in the Baseline League (Los Osos, Rancho Cucamonga, Upland, Etiwanda) anymore.
    One of the main talking points that are always used in these meeting is the
    fact that the distance that teams have to travel is a detriment to the high
    school experience. Schools like Chino Hills and Ayala (with their enormous
    student body) have complained that certain schools don’t travel very well. How
    many fans from St. Lucy’s like to travel all the way to Chino Hills for a girls
    basketball game at night? Sure, if it’s a big game (Charter Oak football
    against Chino Hills), fans will travel. My point is that fans will travel to
    big games in this new 10-team league due to the close proximity of each school.
    Sure, the distance from Glendora to Los Altos would be virtually the same as
    from St. Lucy’s to Chino Hills but at least the teams would be in a more even
    league. They will ALSO travel to smaller, low profile games as well. It wouldn’t
    be a big deal for playoff divisions either. In football, the teams could play
    in the Southeast Division. Charter Oak, even though they are dominating in the
    SGV, hasn’t really stepped up to the plate in the Inland Division. The teams in
    the Hacienda League wouldn’t have to move playoff divisions in this
    realignment. Glendora and South Hills would also get relief as they would also
    move from the Inland Division into the Southeast Division. In softball,
    Glendora would move from Div. 1 to Div. 2 (where everyone else in this proposed
    league already is). In baseball, the teams in the old Hacienda would move to
    Div. 2 or the old Sierra teams and Glendora would move to Div. 3. Basketball
    divisions are out of whack as it is. CIF would probably keep those the same. What
    releaguing comes down to is politics. As you can see with South Hills, Covina,
    and Northview, deals are being made. Deals have been made in the past. For
    example, Rowland didn’t want South Hills in their new league when the San
    Antonio League split up a couple of years back. South Hills wasn’t liked in the
    past because of the dominance that they had shown in various sports. Little did
    people know that Walnut was the highest ranked team in the San Antonio League
    when it came to league championships in both boys and girls sports. South Hills
    was kicked out of the San Antonio League because of their “dominance” in sports
    but they weren’t even ranked higher than Walnut? Politics. Some of those
    principals that made their deals years ago aren’t even at their respective
    schools anymore.

  • Ray_Morehart

    Hey Fred. I like what you have as your league proposals. The Hacienda is perfect the way you have it. The only thing that I would maybe change would be San Dimas to the Hacienda South in place of Rowland while Rowland would go to the Valle Vista League? That would offer Rowland some relief. San Dimas has dominated the Valle Vista League for YEARS. They deserve to move leagues. There is no reason that San Dimas can always squeak by in the Valle Vista League.

    • Catz

      Ray, San Dimas is one of the smallest schools. They have only won 4 league titles in football ever, so I wouldn’t call that dominating. Covina actually has “dominated” as a total sports program. Hoops (boys/girls), track, baseball. Valley Vista league football goes in cycles, Covina gets theirs in pairs, SD breaks it up and Northview sneaks in. SD is Fine where they are with Covina, Northview, and BP….. they just need coaching. When Heggins was the coach they were doing fine

      • GP AKA Green Machine

        San Dimas has 1 title,
        3 Semifinals appearances in 5 years. Covina has 2 league titles ,1 2nd round appearence and1 semifinals appearance in 5 years… Covina won’t beat SD anytime soon.

      • Ray_Morehart

        You’re talking just about football. I’m talking about every sport as a whole. San Dimas has been ranked by the league schools as the top program. It’s time to move on. San Dimas should play with the big boys and girls in a new league.

  • http://www.facebook.com/james.escarcega James Escarcega

    If you look back in the archives, this North/South proposal was first brought to light by yours truly. I said once and I will say it again, let’s use Cameron Ave as the border with teams North of it in one division and teams in the South in another division.

    What you do is that the nasty two word phrase “competitive equity” out of the conversation, (I think Rob Wigod made up that phrase), take the emotion away from the conversation, and what you have are two really nice divisions.

    The rivalries are untouched, transportation is reduced and – most importantly – their is opportunity to make some money on Friday nights with a big gate.

    What Fred has on the board makes great sense… It’s time for the principals and AD’s to rally behind it and make it happen!

    BTW, yes this football driven… but – this would be a great baseball league as well. Who wouldn’t want to see South Hills take on Glendora…or Diamond Bar?

    • Ray_Morehart

      I don’t see any negatives to the proposal regarding the Hacienda North and the Hacienda South. I feel that it would be great for ALL sports. Football, baseball, softball, basketball. The league matchups would be awesome every single week in all sports

      • Give me a break

        The negatives that the schools will look at with this configuration is that you will basically have 2 x 5 team leagues which = only 4 playoffs spots for 10 teams. With the recent CIF reconfiguration 5 and 7 team leagues are bad numbers while 6 team leagues (3 playoffs spots for 6 team leagues) seems to be the ideal number.

  • http://www.facebook.com/james.escarcega James Escarcega

    Totally disagree. It raises the bar and teams that make the playoffs are quality teams that are capable of making a run in the playoffs. This is not basketball were practically everyone makes it….Most agree, this is a perfect fit!

  • Steve Ramirez

    Where’s Nogales? Freelance?

    • GP AKA Green Machine

      VVL

      • Steve Ramirez

        Not in Fred’s proposal.

  • anonymous

    Always been a little confused about Duarte and the Montview League. They are in the foothill area yet play in an ESGV league. But represents the WSGV in the HOF game. I would imagine the RHL or MVLwould make more sense. They must be a tweener school for SGV Tribune and Star News.

  • jcaz

    Just heard a rumor that the UCLA basketball coach has been fired.

  • Wells

    Fred —
    If the East SGV is kept intact (the way you have done) there are 26 teams.
    There could be four six team leagues and one eight team leagues. At the end of each year, the top team from a league would move up and the bottom team would move down. This would give schools relief on a yearly basis.
    Although, if Nogales went into the Valle Vista League, it would keep all leagues with an even number of teams. That is something that is very helpful when creating schedules.

  • BulldogDad

    Ayala need to get out of the Sierra league. When was the last time they won. Losing kids to Chino Hills all the time. A drop down would help keep there kid at there school.