• Anonymous

    are we gonna stack up on 3 star type players….again? comon neu and chow, cant u get better?

  • Anonymous

    Dont look too much at stars as oppose to other schools that have offered.

    Also, take into account that this early in the recruiting game, if you hold offers from pac 10 schools, you are a pretty decent prospect.

  • BruinJigs

    I like that we got a commitment from a DT, but he is just a 250 pounder. That leaves us with two undersized DT’s and with the status of DT position, I think we need to get at least one guy that can play right away and does not need to use a redshirt year to gain the necessary weight to play the position.

  • Bruinswin!

    Do you guys have any idea how ridiculously difficult it is to find quality DT’s coming out of high school?

    Don’t get too picky. Expecting Rick to just pull any 4-5 star DT who happens to weigh 300 lbs is really reaching.

    These kids do grow you know

  • lavsmousse

    First people complain that we don’t have any commits. Then they moan, when we get the verbals, that they don’t have enough stars. Finally they whine that the verbals aren’t big enough. Relax people, wait until LOI day and then analyze our recruits. Until then all this talk means squat.


    People forget these recruits still have their Sr year to improve. Let’s see where things stand in February.

  • BruinFaithful

    Who? I was hoping it was Marquis Flowers.

    I don’t get this Brian, so we are supposedly waiting later to see how players develop before offering, by offering 3 Star recruits, but not the 4 and 5 Star ones?

    This makes no sense and seems to be a detraction from our previously stated recruiting strategy.

  • BruinFaithful

    BRUIN NC and Lavsmousse and others:

    Listen, I don’t care how much recruits develop over their Senior year. This is a clear detraction from our previously stated strategy of waiting until guys develop, before offering or going after them hard. I don’t care what you say. The odds are not in your favor that all, or that a majority of your 3 star recruits will develop. The fact of the matter is, the more 3 Star recruits you have, the harder it will be to put immediate performers on the field.

    I know some of you will say Stars don’t matter. That’s a bunch of Hogwash. Stars aren’t the only factor, but they are a MAJOR factor. The SC’s, Florida’s, and Texas’s of the world don’t win with a majority of 3 star recruits. We didn’t win 20 games in a row with 3 Star recruits. You never know how these kids are going to develop, but it is a FACT that 3 Star recruits are overall a higher risk than the 4 and 5 star recruits.

    Show me one school that is a consistent contender with only 2 and 3 Star recruits?

    Most of your guy’s contention on here is that this staff is a master at discovering underrated talent. I don’t think so.

  • andismaclow

    I will give you one that some said should have been in National Title Contention. Utah…they consistently get 2-3 star recruits and make it work. Good coaching and blue-collar players that want to work made great teams.

  • BruinFaithful


    I said consistent contenders. One season does not make you consistent.

    They also have a majority of players who are essentially 6th and 7th year player. Guys who have taken missions and are 24-25 year olds who have matured physically and mentally. How many NFL talents will you have off that team? Exactly?

    I probably could have been pretty good too, if I was a 22, 23 or 24 year old competing with 18-20 year olds. Think about it. These guys are men playing against boys out there sometimes.

  • VBs Cat

    Stop Crying Bruinfaithful

    waaaaa! he’s only a 3 star….waaaaaaa!!

  • Anonymous

    You guys do realize that services like Scout and Rivals haven’t yet evaluated most of these players, right? The summer combines are where this all happens, so rankings/stars of these players prior to that are basically worthless. You do know that, right?

  • solomonbruin

    3stars that can read and get admitted trumps 5 star criminals that get into another school in the area.

  • amm

    Boise State contends every year with 2 and 3 star players

  • Tustin Dave

    Brian: Was Flowers the silent verbal that you mentioned last week?

  • RodneyGuillory

    lavsmousse has got it right.

    Also, 4 and 5 star kids have to agree to play for you. They don’t just drop out of no where. At some point you have to get the best talent you can and make it work. Then you get 3 and 4 stars…and then you do better and get 4 and 5 stars. Its a process BruinFaithful.

    I’m with Dohn in that star rankings aren’t always the best indicator but obviously a team of 2 to 3 stars isn’t preferred.

  • BruinFaithful

    VB’s cat:

    Ok, I can’t believe I’m going to respond to a cat. Listen here pussycat, nobody is crying here you moron. I merely questioned the change in a stated recruiting philosophy of waiting for players to develop and made arguments for it. If you had a brain you might do the same.

  • High Pitch Eric

    Look at Aundre Dean, 5stars***** on his high school helmet and he couldn’t even crack the 4-deep at UCLA.

    At this point, coming off 4 wins last year, beggars can’t be choosers.

  • Anonymous

    Fact: Chris Forcier was a 4-star recruit.

    Fact: Ben Olson was a 5-star recruit.

    Fact: Stars are practically meaningless.

  • Coach Thom

    Agree with Mr Anonymous…the stars are only a rough indication of a kid’s potential. Each recruit requires close in-person, on the field scrutiny and evaluation. I believe our current coaching staff can best determine who’s right for our system.

  • bbruin

    bruinfaithful – you really think they offer these guys without evaluating them? They have been up to see him, they have seen his tape, he has been to camp.

    Dude have some faith or change your name.

  • Mario DiLeo

    “We didn’t win 20 games in a row with 3 Star recruits…”

    bruinfaithful, how many stars did McNown have? How ’bout Skip Hicks? Danny Farmer? The planets were aligned just right for Bob Toledo when the Bruins ran off 20 consecutive wins and didn’t hurt that the OL was pretty good those two years (I don’t remember Kris Faris having more than 3 stars at Rancho Santa Margarita HS).

    Using a basketball analogy, it seems that Steve Lavin had the #1 recruiting class in the country one year (Gadzuric, Barnes, Moiso, Hines, Young) and what happened? That’s right…nothing. So it’s not who you pick up, it’s what you do with the talent.

  • TruBruin

    When is gubon13 going to join BruinFaithful and Chicken Little to start screaming the sky is falling!
    Some of you guys are killing me here, especially Mr. BruinFaithful. Dude, with your lack of faith I dont think those letters should be in your posting name. For Gods sake, “change of strategy” we have less commits than any other school, have you ever heard the term silent commit? Any of you screaming the sky is falling this early on are out to lunch. Back away from Scout and Rivals and take a Paxil or something dude!
    The Flowers kid is 6’4″ #254 and is a year away. the majority of DT’s dont play at 300+ people, they need some speed too!
    These recruiting sites your addicted to just recently put a rating on these guys anyway, some could easily be 4 stars by the end of their senior season and you will be able to add more stars on your refrigerator chart later. Relax………….

    A BCS Fiesta Bowl win and a BCS Sugar Bowl win in the last 5 years along with a swift ass-whooping of us two years ago makes UTAH pretty consistant in my mind dude.
    The reason is UTAH has had quality coaching to improve the 2-3 star guys.

  • BruinFaithful


    On the surface, this would seen like a good choice. Don’t get me wrong, I love what Chris Peterson does and what he has done up there. Nobody does more with less than him. He is an incredible schemer.

    He was actually my first choice for UCLA coach. I think we should have rolled the carpet out for him. However, I said consistent contender. That means playing in BCS and/ or close to BCS games year in and out. Which is where we want to be, right? They have not achieved this and one Great, yet very fortunate, win against Oklahoma does not change this. They play in an EXTREMELY weak conference, which keeps them very healthy at season’s end. This year they play powerhouses such as:

    ’08 record
    Miami, of Ohio 2-10
    Fresno State 7-6
    Bowling Green 6-6
    UC Davis 5-7 in Division 1-AA
    Tulsa 11-3(Another Boise State type team,
    great record in a weak Div.
    They also lost to Houston 70-
    Hawaii 7-7
    San Jose St. 6-6
    Louis. Tech 8-5
    Idaho 2-10
    Utah St. 3-9
    Nevada 7-6
    NM State 3-9

    Are you kidding me? I would take this schedule anyday. The only decent team they play is Oregon 10-3, which they barely beat last year 37-32 and they play at home this year. Their opponents have a combined record of 77-87, and only thanks to Tulsa and Oregon.

    Over the last 7 years they have only beaten 4 ranked teams. #10 Oregon in ’08 37-32, #21 Oregon St. in ’06 42-14, #11 Oklahoma ’06 43-42, and TCU ’03 34-31. Hardly dominating or considered consistent contenders. Any team that wins 11-12 games in a seasons is going to be ranked at the end of the year, regardless of conference. NO WAY they do this in a Major Conference.

  • Anonymous

    Chris Peterson is not the coach of Utah.

  • gubon13

    Still waiting on that alimony check, TruBruin…

  • Johnny Angel


    Players develop in more ways than physically and game skills. Kids which the coaches deem to have the physicality and on field skills to play d1 *and* which have demonstrated the mental and emotional maturity to hit the ground running as a student at UCLA are going to get earlier offers. The coaches aren’t waiting for an aspect of these players to develop.

  • BruinFaithful

    Mario DiLeo:

    What are you talking about those 1997 and 1998 teams were loaded with talent and highly rated recruits? Cade McKnown and Brock Huard were considered the best QB’s in the West and amongst the best in the country. Skip Hicks was also one of the top RB’s in the country coming out of HS. Then we got Deshaun Foster in 1998, who was considered the best RB in the country.

  • BruinFaithful

    TruBruin and others:

    You obviously are NOT listening to anything I said. I have made very valid points. My biggest is that the staff has delineated from it’s very own new policy, as reported by Brian the last few months, of waiting for talent to develop, based on what they saw on the playing field, before pushing for commitments from recruits. This is what Brian said was the reason that we didn’t have as many commits, because the staff was not going to push them for commitments until they saw them develop. Some camp is not the playing field. You can’t assess a kid’s talent based on running around some freaken cones either pal. And stars aren’t the end all be all and there will ALWAYS be busts. But statistically 4 and 5 Star recruits perform better than 2 or 3 Stars. I know Stars don’t measure intangibles, such as heart and coaching.

    However, I guarantee you any coach would much rather have 5 star recruits that fit his system than 2-3 star recruits. Just natural. And stars do measure talent. They are based on the on field performance of players in games, their performance at camps, their performance against equally high level talent at All Star games and camps, the opinions of players by writers, recruiting experts, FB evaluators, and coaches and the quality of the programs that have offered them.

    All I’m saying, is that if we are going to determine a strategy, then we should stick with it and this does not seem to do so.

    Over the last 7 years, nobody has won more games on the field than USC. Over that period, nobody has had a higher star average. Much of their winning has to do with coaching, but it is also indicative of the level of talent they bring in consistently. Enough said. This is indisputable.

  • awash

    Dear Bruinfaithful:

    You have alot of great valid pts. Obviously the coaching staff cannot comment on the verbal commits, but I’m sure they have very good reasons for offering these guys.

    One key factor that u r missing is academic ability. Of course we want all 5 and 4 star recruits, if we could! Let’s b realistic, a majority of these guys probably have a “C” average. Now if UCLA came recruiting u and said, “Son we would love to have u, but you need to raise your grades!! For your senior year you need to get a B average in your core academic classes. Or the alternative of Florida, Ohio St, Texas and SC recruiting you and saying “all ya gotta do is maintain a “C” average in your senior year and you’ll have no problem getting u in. Where do u think that 5 star recruit is going?

    It’s very refreshing to hear the we r getting a 4.0 GPA quarterback. It probably allows us to get some of those guys with 2.5 GPA’s on board, that r special admits. Bruinfaithful – I’m sure your highschool GPA was probably 3.75 or above to be admitted to UCLA and u should know that admissions does not like to admit kids with GPA’s below 3.0 in their core academics.

    Let’s have some faith that the coaching staff knows what they r doing and the balancing act they must have to follow vs across town.

    Rick goes to admissions – You know I just recruited 2 kids wit 4.0 and 3.5 GPA. Now I want u to special admit this kid with a 2.75 GPA. Would u pls consider it.

    Pete – u know I got this running back with a 2.0 GPA, that is probably going to win a Heisman and take us to a $National Championship$. Admissions folks (aka Mike Garret) no problem just get me more 4 and 5 star recruits. BTY what’s a GPA?

  • nyc bruin

    Big Picture

    4 – 8: We’re lucky we have 4 and 5 star guys even considering us.

    Win next year and they’ll come.

  • cv

    Look Rick has to bring in somebody, he doesn’t have the luxury of waiting. He needs bodies, if they don’t work out he can just run them off next year.

  • TruBruin

    I have a proposal, can we all agree that BruinFaithful needs to change his name to BruinStatGeek?

    Dude, maybe you should take a ritalin and Prozac combo

    Stat geeks like yourself obsess on the numbers, Faith is nowhere found in your reasoning.

    DOHN is a reporter, he reports what his scorces tell him. What do you think they are going to say when he ask why we have zero commits when Stanford has 15?

    One thing is for sure, they are not going to reveal all their cards in their hand until later in the game.

    2 years ago we had the #1 recruiting class during the football season and SC decided that they were waiting to long to offer kids. Last year they had offers all over the place early and they now feel like that was a mistake because it gave other teams to much time to negative recruit against them. This situation is fluid and judgment should be reserved until signing day.

    We just came off one of the best recruiting classes we have had in a decade that addressed many issues especially the O-Line. After languishing through the Dorrell years I think you need to gain some perspective

  • Miro

    This is really a pointless discussion. 300lb DTs often don’t have the speed to be effective on the D-Line. As such, many make the move to the O-Line (e.g., Darius Savage). For those that remember Miami in the 80s, they made a habit out of recruiting athletic DEs to play DT.

    I’d also suggest looking at the H.S. weights of recent recruits. You’ll see that the top DTs in college tend to come in in the 250-270lb range. Per Scout, future Bruins Brigham Harwell was 6-1, 250 lbs and Brian Price, 6-3, 270lbs. Across town, Sedrick Ellis was 6-3, 265 lbs out of high school. On usc’s 2002 roster, Shaun Cody was listed at 6-5, 270lbs. Out of HS, I believe he was listed at 6-5, 250.

    My thought would be to at least wait for Scout/Rivals to finish their evaluations before expressing disappointment.

  • VBs Cat

    How many 5* DTs are interested in UCLA???

    according to Scout/Rivals= NONE
    So there goes your Star Ratings arguement.

    Im sure this wont be the last DT to commit. If this groups ends up being Moore/Flowers/Heimuli/Uko or Marsh(3 * on Rivals) no way you can complain about that.

  • La Femme Bruin

    Why recruit a 5* guy just to have a 5* guy? It makes more sense to recruit the type of player that fits best into the system. I imagine the coaches have enough experience between them to know who would fit and who would not. If they like what they see in these recruits (i.e. talent, potential, academics, and character), it makes sense to go ahead and offer them rather than risk them getting antsy and deciding to go somewhere else.

  • Anonymous

    So are any of you who say stars are meaningless brag about Morrell Presley’s?

  • Sunset Bruin

    Many offers have been made to four and five star players. Most will probably come down to signing week in February. If we are shut out during signing week, we will have some solid three star performers to fill in. Good strategy.

  • amm

    No reason for concern because once the season rolls around, and we get wins committed guys from other schools will consider us and we’ll become bigger players for some other top prospects Around the country.

  • bruinbiochem06

    First of all, I am pleased with these two most recent commitments. I believe (and hope) they will develop into contributing players. When I assess players, I much rather base it on the offers they’ve received rather than on solely on the star system. However, I think Bruinfaithful makes some valid points and am in disbelief that most people on this board are not willing to recognize it.

  • gubon13

    Some people on this blog like to argue for the sake of argument.

    Some are so hypocritical that it blows my mind.

    Still others like to rile people up.

    And finally (my personal favorite) there are those who like to pull some meaning out of other people’s words that weren’t there to begin with in order to do one or more of the above.

  • BruinFaithful


    I have faith in the staff and Rick Neuheisel. I think he is a GREAT, impassioned, and dedicated recruiter. We did have great classes the last 2 years. We need to continue to do so.

    I was merely trying to stimulate a deep meaningful dialogue. This kid Wesley seems like a great kid. I saw his video on Scout. He has a 3.7 GPA. Perfect. I just don’t think we are going to get it done at a serious position of need with undersized DT’s with 3 Stars who are ranked #31 and #72 at their positions. Especially, when this was supposed to be a DEEP year for DT’s on the West. A more important question would be, how many DT’s we plan to bring in this year? I hope it is 4-5 and the strategy is to lock in lower ranked DT’s to be safe and then go after the BIGS.

    VB’s Cat, I would be VERY happy with those 5 DT’s coming in.

  • BruinFaithful

    bruinbiochem06 and gubon13:

    Thank you. Finally somebody admitted it.